Hagglers?

[MiamiLooker]

No I'm not haggling. I ask them that AFTER i quote my rate. Because if they're going to say it's too much, i want to know what the fuck they have in mind.

Why?

Plus, how can they place value on a service they've never had to begin with?

How would you know that they've never had the service before? Maybe they've hired before for $100 and been totally satisfied with the service provided. You can't guarantee (or can you?) that your service will be any better.

[jjkrkwood]

Mocha, I suspect you are long-time resident here, although you have changed your handle, I still believe your main problem is that you dont enjoy the business you have chosen and you dont like your clients. It comes thru in your posts. and if you dont enjoy what you are doing, whether someone pays you $100 or $300, you will still find fault. Thats seems to be how its been going for you. You never seem to have a positive experience, no matter what. Your posts are always one-sided and negative. And I dont think that's what clients want to sign up for ?

[LADoug1]

Time together: price is firm. Time for travel expenses, hotels, etc.: may be negotiable and can be up for discussion. In that case it isn't haggling.

[Mocha]

Mocha, I suspect you are long-time resident here, although you have changed your handle, I still believe your main problem is that you dont enjoy the business you have chosen and you dont like your clients. It comes thru in your posts. and if you dont enjoy what you are doing, whether someone pays you $100 or $300, you will still find fault. Thats seems to be how its been going for you. You never seem to have a positive experience, no matter what. Your posts are always one-sided and negative. And I dont think that's what clients want to sign up for ?

 

Whatever. You worry about you liking what you do, and I'll worry about me liking what I do. You're not paying a goddamn thing for me, so how can you be so concerned with whether I like what I do or not? I'm also not fucking you so I don't have to answer you as to whether I'm into who I'm fucking either.

 

Clearly that horrendous wig you or whoever that is in your photo is messing up your head.

[Mocha]

Why?

 

How would you know that they've never had the service before? Maybe they've hired before for $100 and been totally satisfied with the service provided. You can't guarantee (or can you?) that your service will be any better.

 

I'm not TALKING about whoever else they hired for $100, dummy. I'm talking about ME. My service. They haven't tried it if they are trying to consolidate me to a price before even meeting me. What they think this is, Priceline? Even for $100, you just get the room. Doesn't include the hooker in the price.

 

I don't have to present a thesis for anything relating to my money. I've had guys start off paying me a certain amount, but when I presented to them the fact that if they want to expect me to continue the arrangement...when my incall costs go up, I have to compensate for that. I can't just pull dollar bills out of my ass, unless someone slides one between it. That's not preposterous. That's reasonable.

[jjkrkwood]

I'm not TALKING about whoever else they hired for $100, dummy. I'm talking about ME. My service. They haven't tried it if they are trying to consolidate me to a price before even meeting me. What they think this is, Priceline? Even for $100, you just get the room. Doesn't include the hooker in the price.

 

I don't have to present a thesis for anything relating to my money. I've had guys start off paying me a certain amount, but when I presented to them the fact that if they want to expect me to continue the arrangement...when my incall costs go up, I have to compensate for that. I can't just pull dollar bills out of my ass, unless someone slides one between it. That's not preposterous. That's reasonable.

 

Not sure this is what you mean, but I get you were going for a "big" word... Try to proofread before you post hon... You are so focused on ranting, you don't even seem to care if your rants make sense...

[Photojimsf]

I used to pay $500 for haircuts, but as I got older, I was able to negotiate the price down...

 

 

 

I'm quite the little haggler...

 

Paaaahahahaha!

[instudiocity]

Paaaahahahaha!

On July 2 you're reacting to a post from March 21?

 

And all you've got to say is "Paaaahahahaha"?

 

I forgive you but, really? You didn't notice you're resurrecting a thread that no one has viewed in months?

 

I mean BVB is one of my favorites but he probably doesn't remember he's bald by now! :Do_O

[Photojimsf]

Wow I didn't expect quite a response when I posted this and now I'm kinda mad I didn't make that swap meat pun.

 

I can understand why this is such a divisive topic and I did get some great suggestions from you guys.

 

I'm not really complicated. My donation is a flat rate and I don't mind lowering it for an ongoing thing. These two guys were kind of shaky but I'll definitely let potential clients know I'm open to it.

 

 

Hi Gene,

You have a sexy profile pic, btw.

 

Having been on both sides of the coin at one time or another, I've experienced the stereotypes at both ends:

a. The pushy, haggling cheapskates who try to take as much as they can

b. The arrogant, too cute for their own good professionals who think they're God's gift, charge as much as they can, and give as little as they can in return

 

Happily, most encounters fall somewhere near the happy middle. As a rule, I think it's pushy and awkward asking for a discount on first meeting, and it's a sign of a difficult customer.

But I also think it's a sign of experience and maturity when a professional can offer or accommodate a discount, especially for regulars.

 

One factor I haven't seen discussed as much: supply and demand.

If you're a busy professional making good money, there's less need to give discounts. Great for you and how lucky you are!

Most however, are not making enough, and should give consideration to flexible pricing/marketing, to get more business.

This was back in the 90's, but I had good success by advertising a price range, and letting the customer decide.

[Photojimsf]

On July 2 you're reacting to a post from March 21?

 

And all you've got to say is "Paaaahahahaha"?

 

I forgive you but, really? You didn't notice you're resurrecting a thread that no one has viewed in months?

 

I mean BVB is one of my favorites but he probably doesn't remember he's bald by now! :Do_O

 

 

Thanks for forgiving me, I'm a newbie. But as a baldie, I found his comment pretty funny.

[jjkrkwood]

On July 2 you're reacting to a post from March 21?

 

And all you've got to say is "Paaaahahahaha"?

 

I forgive you but, really? You didn't notice you're resurrecting a thread that no one has viewed in months?

 

I mean BVB is one of my favorites but he probably doesn't remember he's bald by now! :Do_O

 

 

LOL @instudiocity. I am glad you forgave him , since we all have been "late cummers" at one time or another.

[+ José Soplanucas]

Welcome to the forums @Photojimsf ! Your participation is always appreciated.

[Photojimsf]

Welcome to the forums @Photojimsf ! Your participation is always appreciated.

Oh thanks pal, very nice of you.

[MasterMaxRR]

I’m 35 years old and began doing escort when I was 17. I’ve hired many, many boys over the years and have worked a fair bit with other escorts as well, so it’s very easy for me to reflect on both sides of this particular issue.

 

 

In truth, many questions posted on this site represent what seems to be a black and white issue. However, with humanity involved, the black and white issue becomes infinitely complicated. In this case, it’s either be offended by haggling or don’t. Having said that, most of the arguments for one side or the other have very valid points. It’s easy to get away from the OP’s specific question asking if it’s common for clients to haggle, but at the same time all of these digressions allows the chance to see this issue in it’s full light. The one thing that I find salient to the OP is….. drumroll please….

 

 

Yes, in my experience, it is quite common. End of story. Now I will attempt to address my perspective on what everyone else has said.

 

 

My advice, pick a stance on this issue that creates less stress for you and stick with it. Having to feel as if you’re constantly compromising yourself to get business or an escort is the quickest way to burn out and carry resentment which is a total boner killer for all parties involved. Personally, I think there is nothing wrong with haggling as long as it’s done in good fun. At the same time, when someone attempts to negotiate, it makes me regard that person slightly differently, since at that point I have to find out WHY they’re haggling. Simply saying "no negotiation" does have it’s appeal sometimes, but I've met hagglers that if I'd maintained the "no negotiation" rule, the loss would have been profoundly mine.

 

 

 

The clients that attempt to haggle are indeed sometimes the worst to deal with, but the converse is true as well. I’ve had wealthy clients who overpaid and made me feel more used than a haggler ever could. I’d rather deal with someone trying to cheat me because they’ve always been cheated or are afraid of being screwed themselves vs. a rich man who cheats me because of a sense of entitlement and genuinely feels joy at taking advantage of those he perceives as weaker or less than he. The first, I understand and can work with, the other is quite beyond me and usually never hear from me again.

 

 

Having said that, I use a system that has always, always worked for me. I am aware that it may not work for most escorts, but perhaps with an adjustment or two you can find a way to make it work for you. Also know that I work as an escort within the BDSM scene now and that affords me certain luxuries mainstream escorts don’t have, but I spent my formative tricking years working as a more mainstream escort in San Francisco.

 

 

When someone asks me to negotiate and gives the excuse that they really can’t afford it, I just inform them that I am willing to accept barter or labor in exchange for the difference. This allows me to work with genuine people who are willing to work for what they want but can’t always pay in money. The negotiators that do it simply because they want to cheat you and feel good about it often falter at this point. Additionally I find that by giving someone a chance to work with me on painting the fence or mowing my lawn gives me the chance to get to know them in a different way than a simple business transaction would offer. This approach won’t work for everyone, but I hope it’s a different perspective that allows you to find your own stance on this issue and find ways to manage both sides of the coin.

 

 

Having worked in this business for so many years and having been ripped off plenty, I empathize with the ones that just shut down when someone attempts to haggle and indeed, I have my own moments where I consider that very option. To those that have reached this point, I would simply suggest that you try to maintain an open mind when someone attempts to negotiate, but the second you feel someone is manipulating you just to get a better deal out of spite, Shut ‘em down and run. It’s just not worth the hassle. Another bit of advice to this group of people is to charge a little more than is warranted and that way you “negotiate” down to your normal base rate. They got a deal, you got a fair price. Everyone wins. Sometimes even $20 extra is enough to find this balance as it’s often not about the money, but the principle of the matter. Additionally, offering this small concession and then rocking their world usually end up getting the concession back as gratuity. On the flip side, a client that is willing to pay the higher price, then simply take the extra if they’re rude, or make them feel special by offering a “price break” if they’re genuine and sweet. The hard part is deciding how much more to charge to weed out the riff raff while still not driving away potential clients that just can’t afford top dollar. No right or wrong about it really, just what greases the wheels of karma and keeps you happy as an escort or client. I would also recommend reading the postings that address the question "Tip or no Tip?", it has surprising insight into this very issue.

 

 

If you’re desperate for cash and have no choice but to take any offer you’re given, just give yourself a pat on the back, realize that it will get better, and do your job with every ounce of dignity and pride you have even though it may seem like the hardest thing to do. I’ve been there, and if this is you, reach out to me and I will send all the love your way that I can. I can’t fix your problems, but knowing you’re not alone is often all most people need to get through a rough spot.

 

 

 

Sorry to go on at length, but scratch an old prostitute on the surface, and very often you’ll find a philosopher and student of human nature within.

 

 

Love and Light,

 

Master Max

 

 

 

P.S. English is my second language so please forgive me for my tendency to run on in a sentence.

[DonaldTramp]

I would never have guessed English is your second language, you write quite well. But, please, please enough with the "love & light"...I feel like I'm reading a post from one of the Real Housewives of New Jersey!

[DonaldTramp]

http://www.realitytea.com/2013/07/29/real-housewives-of-new-jersey-recap-6/

[MasterMaxRR]

?? Really ?? I don't watch tv, so I've never seen that show lol. It's a common expression among those who do yoga, but if it's that linked to a reality show.... Darn it, now I have to come up with something... Any ideas? I haven't even clicked the link, because it would probably confirm why I don't watch tv.

 

 

Peace and Hugs! :D:D

Max

[DonaldTramp]

You seem much too nice to be a BDSM escort. Personally, if I was looking for a BDSM experience, I would look for someone who signed their correspondence with " Go fuck yourself" or "Suck my dick". But, that's just me!

[MasterMaxRR]

Lol.... Too funny. But, you have given me an opening to explain what I'm about. This is why there are no dumb questions. You've pointed out a common question that comes from people that have no understanding of what S/M is really for and seek to understand it. For that, I thank you immensely.

 

Outside of sessions, I'm a kind, understanding and patient Master unless asked to do otherwise. During a session however, when appropriate, I really am a cruel asshole and I savor every moment of it. If you doubt this, I can put you in touch with my head slave who can enlighten you in the fact that you don't have to use the stereotypical attitude of a master to be cruel. I often find the contrast between the nice me and the asshole me keeps the client way off kilter mentally. Some think I'm insane because I go from soft and sweet to screaming and evil in a flash, and then right back to soft and sweet all in the space of a few minutes. If they think I'm crazy, then that's the exact effect I wanted to have.

 

Two rules I have for beginners is, one, NEVER dare a Sadist. Trust me, they're just waiting for a flash of defiance or a battle of wills so they can use that to show the slave his true and rightful place. Two, anything you say can and will be used against you in the dungeon.

 

Also, there are too many beginners that would be easily scared off by such an approach and since I'm starting the business in a city where there really is very few S/M masters available, I need to set the tone that I am a human being first and foremost. Then, when I have won their trust, I use that trust to take them beyond their own limits in pain, degradation and humiliation. Even a young green branch can snap if bent to far. The tricky bit is keeping them in the state of being bent to nearly the breaking point and holding them there. Let me write a session as an example. (I have asked permission from the slave to share this story.) this was not a paid session so I can be descriptive without fear of LEO's.

 

One time, I had a very good friend of mine ask me to walk him though a session out of curiosity but was terrified to do it. He is a super kind hearted and generous soul, and I used even that against him. He broke a rule and I was forced to name a terrible punishment of 10 cane strikes to the body (knowing full well he was terrified of the idea, and also knowing a caning was not appropriate for a first time session) The terror in his eyes was truly delicious. Then, I told him I would do the worst thing I could imagine for him. I took his punishment. The look of terror on his face changed to elation for a brief moment that he wasn't going to be caned before his mind comprehended what I had said and what that meant. To see his face crumple and tears falling down his face while he begged me to hit him instead made my dick solid. While demanding that he look me in the eyes, I hit myself on my arms, legs and back hard enough the I left a small permanent scar on my forearm. By the time I had finished, he was a weeping sobbing mess. I then told him he was forgiven and gave him the softest sweetest fuck while he weeped from shame, but that didn't stop him from blowing his load all over my jail cell floor without having his dick touched.

 

After the session, he was allowed to ask me why I had chosen to do that. He was much relieved to know that I simply was in the mood for a a little pain, but I knew how compassionate he was and only did it that way to really mess with his head. To this day, every time we meet, he gives me a hug and touches the small scar on my arm, shakes his head and I can see him lost in the memory. That alone made the pain of breaking his heart worth it, a million times over.

 

That my friend is an expression of ultimate cruelty even though I never harmed a hair on his head or used profane cruel language.

 

Alternatively, if you start evil and full hardcore, you have left yourself in a position of not being able to do a build up. When you start at level 10, there's nowhere to go.

 

 

You sir, are not even worthy to lick the bottom of my boot much less the top of it. If I thought you had any hope of being trained to be a good slave, I would tell you to get on your knees and stare at my hard-on for an hour knowing full well you don't deserve to look upon it much less suck it. Now kindly get lost.

 

Do you see? I would never say the above to you and mean it, but it's an example of how to be cruel and degrading while still maintaining a sense of love and light. (Bazinga!)

 

Remember, all master's are dominant's, but not all dominant's can be masters. Hopefully you understand what this means after reading my response. If you can't then I have failed to present it in a way that you can understand, and that makes me a little sad. I welcome questions you may have as this is a key component in understanding what BDSM is all about. To be able to express my cruel side to its fullest is a form of catharsis, and that is why I refuse to work without a safe word. They can stop it any time they wish, but the best of what I do is take them to the point of just before they use their safe word and keep them right on the knife edge of that boundary without triggering the actual safe word. It's a dangerous, exhilarating and exhausting job, but the rewards of teaching a slave that they are capable of taking much more than they thought possible makes it all worth it.

 

Hope this helps!

 

Love and Light, Hate and Darkness.

Master Max

[beachboy]

Why say one word when 50 will do?!

[MasterMaxRR]

Why say one word when 50 will do?!

 

You should come to one of my lectures! It's even worse!!!

 

Hugs

Master Max

[beachboy]

At least that's more civil than your original reply when you told me to procreate with myself- classy. Not.

[MasterMaxRR]

Yes, not my best moment indeed. My apologies!

 

Hugs,

Max

[mbFucker]

Good topic