n00b question: escorts who DEMAND a tip?

[spunky]

Hello there much-wiser-and-experienced people. I have a little bit of a n00b question of something that happened during one of my hires which I didn’t quite like and would like to see how common situations like these are or what the appropriate way of handling it would have been.

 

So Mr X (my escort) and I got together for a session. He’s a mountain of muscle (body-builder, personal trainer, the whole yadda-yadda) and I’m a pretty skinny/lanky guy (this is bit of info is relevant later). We have had a session a few days before in which for some reason I was in a cowboy boots mood (don’t ask what they were used for but I presume everyone has a pretty good idea already) but he didn’t own any… so I thought the easiest solution would be to buy him a pair and let him keep them + the receipt in case he didn’t like them and wanted to exchange them for something else. So we’re talking about a $300 “gift” for the guy, not counting his rate (which is also $300). For this session in question I asked him to wear the boots again, we did stuff, and two things that rubbed me the wrong way happened. The first one was that he had been to the store where I got the boots (because he didn’t like them) and tried to find something that was more “his style” so he could exchange them. Because he didn’t find anything, he wanted to take me to the store so I could get a refund on my credit card and later go on a shopping spree with him using the refunded amount. The second one was that after he dropped that bomb he casually mentioned “oh, and btw, it is OK to tip for my sessions”. I was pretty pissed to be honest, but a little bit freaked out because one of this dude’s arms is like my two legs together and we were alone in his place… so being mindful of my position I just added another $10 bill and said that I’m a credit-card-only boy so I couldn’t add anything else at the moment and that although I didn’t have the time to do the whole boots-for-cash situation now, I asked him to just txt me later once I was out of school so we could do it together. In the end I of course just kept ignoring his later txts about potential meeting times and subsequent requests for more sessions together

even though, as it became somewhat evident to me, I apparently became his primary source of income for a while (yes, he even tried to guilt-trip me saying that he was counting on “my support” to pay his rent).

 

So in the end… how do people handle escorts who *request* a tip? In my world (where I see escorting just as another service I pay for) a tip is something you EARN, not something you should expect. And second… I mean, wow! I just had to vent the fact that, in my mind, I was going like “dude… I just gave you a $300 dollar gift. You can recycle it. You can exchange it and get something for someone else as a holiday gift…. And now you want ME to spend MY time taking you on a shopping spree?” Anyway, I feel better now that I’ve gotten this off my chest.

[tyro]

I'd never go back to a guy who treated me like this. Tips are earned.

T

[josephga]

fire him

[+ azdr0710]

sorry for the hassle with this guy....as for the boots/store: he is on his own and can very much go find something he ultimately will like there, if he wants (that's why you gave the receipt)....obviously, his request to cash out the boots is way over the top and you can forget about meeting him at the store....as for him saying "tipping is OK": I'll cut him a tiny (very, very tiny) bit of slack on that as he may just be a little unsophisticated in matters like that....he obviously wants to make money and is trying to do that in some way....but it certainly is not a good thing to say in this context....all my meets have been decent and I usually tip about 5-10% because I'm glad to have met them, I had a good time, and I want them to remember me for being a decent guy next time....

 

and I wouldn't worry about getting beat up or whatever because he's bigger than you.....

[seeker630]

While I think the escort handled the situation poorly, I suspect things may have looked a bit different from his perspective.

 

Your gift to him was really primarily a prop for your sexual encounter, and only secondarily a gift (I noticed your use of " "). You don't mention what sort of store you purchased the boots at (I'm wondering if it was a specialty store?), but apparently there was nothing else there he liked or needed. You said you didn't mind if he returned them for something else but..he couldn't, really.

 

Basically, he said he'd rather have the $$ than the boots. And I also wonder if that's what he meant when he said he took tips (i.e., rather than 'gifts'.) Reading your post,

he casually mentioned “oh, and btw, it is OK to tip for my sessions”. - doesn't really sound like a 'demand'.

 

I owuld never had the balls to so explicitly ask for something I liked or needed, but...he did.

 

Sadly, I think you both lose.

[corndog]

I'm going to take a different position on this... (edit: well, seeker beat me to it.)

 

First of all, from what you've said, he mentioned a tip, and you felt intimidated because of his size and strength, but it doesn't sound like he really demanded a tip, or tried to intimidate you.

 

Second, let's assume that the guy is a bit down on his luck, and $300 is a big deal to him -- rent money that he needs. Cowboy boots aren't really his personal style (nor, perhaps, is anything else at the Western Wear store that maybe they came from), but he could really use the $300. From his perspective, you tossed out $300 without much concern, so you've sent the message that money like that is no big deal to you. When he said it's ok to tip, maybe what he was really trying to say is "Please don't waste your money on any more expensive gifts that I don't want, I could really use cash." Although I'm sure your heart was in the right place, an expensive gift can be painful when you're having trouble making ends meet.

 

So, I'm sure that I've made some incorrect assumptions when reading between the lines of your story, but, regardless of the details, consider the possibility that this guy is perhaps well-intentioned but socially inept, unsophisticated, or unaccustomed to being around this kind of money. I'm not saying this wasn't extremely bad manners, I'm just urging you to consider that it might have been more ignorance than malice.

[bigvalboy]

While I think the escort handled the situation poorly, I suspect things may have looked a bit different from his perspective.

 

Your gift to him was really primarily a prop for your sexual encounter, and only secondarily a gift (I noticed your use of " "). You don't mention what sort of store you purchased the boots at (I'm wondering if it was a specialty store?), but apparently there was nothing else there he liked or needed. You said you didn't mind if he returned them for something else but..he couldn't, really.

 

Basically, he said he'd rather have the $$ than the boots. And I also wonder if that's what he meant when he said he took tips (i.e., rather than 'gifts'.) Reading your post,

he casually mentioned “oh, and btw, it is OK to tip for my sessions”. - doesn't really sound like a 'demand'.

 

I owuld never had the balls to so explicitly ask for something I liked or needed, but...he did.

 

Sadly, I think you both lose.

 

Well I am sorry that all of this happened to you, but I agree with Seeker on this. I think that his analysis is spot on. I think both of you should have communicated better. The boots were your idea, not his, so that really is not a tip as far as I would be concerned. If it were me, and I did not like his hinting at wanting a tip, or his preference for money as opposed to a gift, I would have said something immediately, although in a light and humorous tone, but I would have said something.

 

Lastly, since he did not threaten you, though you seemed intimidated, I don't feel that ignoring him was particularly the fair way to treat him. He obviously got the impression from somewhere that you were going to continue hiring him. If that was not your intention, then when you talk to escorts, you have to choose your words very carefully. Escorts often count on clients for support or next months rent,or to pay bills etc., especially if there was some offering of continued hiring. As clients we often say things casually that escorts take to heart.

 

At any rate, if nothing else, it is a good learning experience. Good luck to you.

[jawjateck]

On the surface, I see both points of view, although I tend to side with the client. But whether he's right or wrong doesn't matter much, once you get in a situation with an escort where things just don't feel right anymore, get yourself safely out of the present situation, then cut him loose and never see him again. As long as you didn't back out of an appointment that cost him money on his end, and have compensated him per the upfront agreement, you have done him no wrong.

 

It happens occasionally that things just turn sour. Move on. There are plenty of fun guys waiting in your future.

[spunky]

Thank you to everyone who replied. To be honest, the “escort standpoint” that many people are presenting where he could have seen the boots as another source of income instead of an unwanted gift (because anyone who’s bought a decent pair of cowboy boots knows they are NOT cheap) is something that did not even remotely cross my mind until now… which makes me feel like a little bit like a douchebag… particularly after re-reading what seeker630/corndog said of maybe the escort thinking “oh wow… the things I could afford with these extra $300 instead of a pair of boots”. Because yeah, the main reason I got the boots was to get off using them and I guess I just passed ‘em on to him (along with the receipt) because I didn’t need them after that. So they were not so much of a “gift” as much as an i-have-no-clue-what-to-do-with-them kind of situation. I guess I just got this feeling that he was maybe trying to milk me out of more money and that’s what made me angry? Like him thinking “well, if this guy can buy me boots and pay for my services maybe he can give me more money…” I dunno. I guess I’ll have to ponder about it more.

 

 

And unfortunately seeker630 is right… He lost what could’ve been a long-lasting business relationship of sorts (because i'd hired him a few times already and did start talking about maybe him setting aside a few 1-hour blocks during the week for me) and I lost his services, which I actually

enjoyed because within his… uhm… how can I phrase it… within his “repertoire of skills” he was able to fulfill a lot of mildly unusual requests I really like. And after all this back-and-forth ignoring I guess I just can’t txt back and pretend nothing happened. Oh man, this hiring boys thing can be more complicated than I thought.

 

 

But would anyone here had actually gone out with him, returned the boots, got the refund and then take him on a shopping spree? Particularly during the holiday season where everyone’s busy (or at least I am)? I think that was WAY out of line, right?

[bigvalboy]

But would anyone here had actually gone out with him, returned the boots, got the refund and then take him on a shopping spree? Particularly during the holiday season where everyone’s busy (or at least I am)? I think that was WAY out of line, right?

 

In a word...no. I think that it is outstanding that you really read everyones response and realize that perhaps there was other was of looking at the situation. It was it appears a good learning experience. Now you can do what you want, and it sounds like it might be too late for this, but if he was as good in bed as you suggest, Hell, I wouldn't let someone like that go over a little misunderstanding about a pair of shoes. I would contact him and talk it out, but that's just me.

 

And to answer your last question, seriously...lol lol how busy are you really? You couldn't take some time to return some shoes? Put the money back on your card and then spend an hour or so at a store shopping for the young man. I would have done that in a heart beat.

 

I do appreciate your thread today, it was very interesting and gave us all a lot to think about...good luck, and if you do change your mind and contact him, please let us all know what happens.

[KMEM]

 

 

 

 

But would anyone here had actually gone out with him, returned the boots, got the refund and then take him on a shopping spree? Particularly during the holiday season where everyone’s busy (or at least I am)? I think that was WAY out of line, right?

 

You have to decide if it was way out of line or not. Other posters are reading what you wrote but were not there. Everyone can have an opinion but it is your emotions and your money and your time. You decide.

 

Best regards,

KMEM

[+ azdr0710]

after reading seeker's and corndog's replies, I think I'll temper my post above....I forgot the boots were mostly for your pleasure, not his....he may've been thinking, "what the fuck are these?...I'm not into cowboy boots".....

 

and definitely text/call him and say you'd love to hook up again, apologize for the boot story (and, yeah, cash them out and give him the dough if he says he'll meet again!), and see if he's up for it....

[Epigonos]

I am going to come at this from a somewhat different angle. First I do not give gifts to escorts; I give gifts to friends and family members. Over the years three escorts I have seen on a regular basis have, for me, crossed over from being guys for hire and have become friends. One of these guys has retired and I no longer see him the other two I continue to see and on occasion give them small gifts. Some clients think nothing of presenting an escort with a jock or underwear they would like him to wear. If you can afford to give an escort $300 boots that you would like him to wear that’s just fine in my book. As far as I’m concerned whether or not the guy would have preferred the money is NOT the issue. You bought him the boots and he should have worn them and kept his mouth shut, they cost him nothing, and if he didn’t like them he could have put them in his closet and used them only when getting together with you. In my book the guy is a lousy escort and a clod.

[jawjateck]

But would anyone here had actually gone out with him, returned the boots, got the refund and then take him on a shopping spree?

 

Hell no! I get that the boots were for your benefit. He didn't like 'em and couldn't find something better as an exchange, so he could just toss 'em. He's not out anything. He was properly compensated as agreed, that makes you a good client. Since he threw in the expectation that tips would be automatic for future meetings, I can almost guarantee that his shopping spree would have cost you a helluva lot more than 300.

[bigvalboy]

after reading seeker's and corndog's replies, I think I'll temper my post above....I forgot the boots were mostly for your pleasure, not his....he may've been thinking, "what the fuck are these?...I'm not into cowboy boots".....and

 

definitely text/call him and say you'd love to hook up again, apologize for the boot story (and, yeah, cash them out and give him the dough if he says he'll meet again!), and see if he's up for it....[/

 

See that is what I am thinking also azdr...especially since Spunky asked us. I say why let a good thing like that go over a pair of boots that no one seems to want...especially if as spunky says, that the escort (ahem) really kinda rocks-his-world...lol lol

[BaronArtz]

I contacted Junior Stellano once - I have this thing for Italian guys from the outer boroughs of NY. He said right away that is fee was $300 per hour, but that his regular clients usually pay him a multiple of that. The implication being: unless if you tip me really well, I am not interested. I passed on him, with some regret because he was totally my type. He no longer escorts. I suppose he is comfortable seeing his regulars who pay him a multiple of $300 per hour ...

[Walker1]

I contacted Junior Stellano once - I have this thing for Italian guys from the outer boroughs of NY. He said right away that is fee was $300 per hour, but that his regular clients usually pay him a multiple of that. The implication being: unless if you tip me really well, I am not interested. I passed on him, with some regret because he was totally my type. He no longer escorts. I suppose he is comfortable seeing his regulars who pay him a multiple of $300 per hour ...

 

That is some twisted logic. I will see you for 300 an hour, but if you become a regular client-you gotta pay 600/900/1200 an hour?? Me thinks there is a reason he no longer escorts!

[BaronArtz]

That is some twisted logic. I will see you for 300 an hour, but if you become a regular client-you gotta pay 600/900/1200 an hour?? Me thinks there is a reason he no longer escorts!

 

I agree - twisted. He must have found some fools willing to pay up though.

 

This guy, on the other hand, could demand anything he wants , Vito Gallo, New York. That is perfection, from top to bottom.

 

https://twitter.com/VitoGalloXXX/status/285533348028366848/photo/1

[bigvalboy]

I agree - twisted. He must have found some fools willing to pay up though.

 

This guy, on the other hand, could demand anything he wants , Vito Gallo, New York. That is perfection, from top to bottom.

 

https://twitter.com/VitoGalloXXX/status/285533348028366848/photo/1

 

 

To ditto one comment on his pic..."Sweet Jesus"...but he still ain't gettin 600+ an hour, not from this cowboy. There are many escorts out there that are just as fine and just charge regular prices. OK my tip drives it up a bit, but that is up to my discretion.

[+ azdr0710]

That is some twisted logic. I will see you for 300 an hour, but if you become a regular client-you gotta pay 600/900/1200 an hour?? Me thinks there is a reason he no longer escorts!

 

actually, I'll bet Junior didn't know what "multiple" meant in this context....but he was cocky enough to say it

[BaronArtz]

actually, I'll bet Junior didn't know what "multiple" meant in this context....but he was cocky enough to say it

 

Junior says he has a MBA degree. Surely, he knows what a multiple is. I think his approach is (was) if you pay me more, you can become a 'regular'. I suppose, although I am not sure, that as a 'regular' you get better 'services' and some preference when you schedule a session. It's a bit like flying business class - still the same plane, just a better seat and a few more services. I mean, I told him I wanted to fuck him. Vanilla. Plain and simple. I didn't want to pay for the 'upgrade' and as a result, I didn't schedule him. Now he still does porn work, but he has stopped escorting. As I said above, there is a good probability that one or more of his 'regulars' keep him in a comfortable lifestyle. There is not wrong with that - except that I don't want to pay for it. No way.

[Phil_musc]

I agree - twisted. He must have found some fools willing to pay up though.

 

This guy, on the other hand, could demand anything he wants , Vito Gallo, New York. That is perfection, from top to bottom.

 

https://twitter.com/VitoGalloXXX/status/285533348028366848/photo/1

 

Oh my, Yes! Nothing wrong with your eyes, Baron!

[JT Brooklyn]

Every Year the Asking Rates seem to go Up! Whether or not most get these Rates my thinking has always been..Tip Included and have never had a guy even hint about a Tip! Unless we are talking about liking the TIP of his Dick Licked!

[down_to_business]

The very first time ever that I contacted an escort was from one of those old gay themed newspaper types that used to have the want ads in the back. I was staying at Circus Circus in Las Vegas. I was nervous as heck. He showed up at the door. he did not look anything at all like his ad. He charged extra for everything. He was straight and all he could do was lie on his back with his eyes closed for the entire time he was there. At the end of the session he enthusiastically informed me that tips were expected and that they often amounted to more than his fee. I paid him his fee in full and my tip I told him was to make appointments with people that stay at better hotels in Las Vegas.

 

I didn't hire another escort for several years after that!

[+ purplekow]

As far as the boots go, you had no further use for the boots and they were purchased for your pleasure, so really you just were emptying your closet of something you did not need and passed it off as a gift. Now if he liked and enjoyed the boots, then this would have worked for him and you. Offering the receipt, for me, was equivalent to saying, '''''i don't want to totally waste these boots. They have values so take these or exchange them for something of equal worth" and though the majority of the responsibility falls on him to get value out of your "gift" you bear some responsibility. You tried to look like a generous benefactor when really you were a client with a boot fantasy and no desire for a souvenir.

I am not sure why you felt intimidated in your last encounter, but that fact that you did is enough. Still, once you are safely out of harm's way, there was no reason to avoid speaking with the man, even just to close the encounter. It may be as others mentioned, that for the escort, the cost of the boots represents a large amount of money while to you it was a trifle spent on a one time sex prop. It seems he misunderstood your intentions and it seems to me that many people would.

 

The take home message here for me is: don't treat your left overs like gifts. You could have told him you were discarding the boots and asked if he wanted them, no strings and no receipt attached. Or you could have returned the boots yourself and left the money with him, if it was indeed your intention to give him a gift.

No matter how much you enjoyed the sex, I would hesitate to go back into a similar situation which may leave you feeling unsafe. Still, ignoring this man's calls is cowardly.

Last point, if you do go back for seconds or is it thirds and fourths, the feel of danger may add a bit of excitement to to encounter, but I would avoid discussing the boots as any further discussion of the boots can only lead to bad feelings, unless you are inclined to take them back and give him the money for them.