A Weighty Issue

[jjkrkwood]

Having and being able to enjoy sexual partners, friends, and neighbors of virtually every culture, ethnicity or race is the greatest gift I could ever imagine.

 

Agreed, variety is the spice of life, BUT not everyone posseses a taste, or Need for "sexual" variety, and they should not be condemned and labelled for their limitations.

[Strafe13]

Strafe, your point are all well taken, and I agree, however the nature of this post was about someone asking another person his race, in the context of a sexual encounter. FACT !. Why READ anything more into it than that??? True, we dont have enuf info about the escort to really know, so therefore WHY crucify him before all the facts are in ?.... There are many members on this site that like to jump on a "political correctness" soapbox. I am all for political correctness, when the situation warrants it. All we have here is BVB's impression that the escort questioned his race because the escort was racist... Maybe, but until thats a Fact, i prefer to take a recess......

 

Perhaps I was mistaken, but my understanding of BVB's story was that the escort asked him a bunch of questions about himself in an effort to ascertain BVB's race, or more specifically to make sure that BVB was not black. The point of such questioning was not to ferret out an acceptable sex partner, but so that the escort could be sure he did not provide his purportedly professional services to a black customer. Within this context, this is about as clear a case of racial discrimination as you'll ever see. Although you see this as just a sexual encounter, for escorts, this is their job -- they see themselves as professionals. Discriminating against customers on the basis of their race is not professional.

[Strafe13]

Another escort who's a master of the verbal mindfuck! One of these days...

 

There are varying definitions of racism with various implications and nuances.

 

A simple definition of racism is making race based decisions. In many cases those decisions are driven by either hatred, ignorance, stupidity or some combination. But maybe not always.

 

There may be times in which it is reasonable to make selections based on race. Like if you wanted to find out what black americans think on some subject, or maybe even to satisfy some fetishistic and possibly even transitory desire.

 

Calling something racist need not be the same as calling that thing wrong. Or hateful or ignorant. In fact the dictionary tells me that racism didn't really become an epithet until after the war.

 

The problem with racism is that there is almost always going to be a better qualifier to use than race. Seriously.

It may not seem unreasonable to say you are looking for an African-American to play the part of MLK in a movie. But even then there may be better qualifiers such as look, build, skin tone, hair color, acting ability, height, accent etc.

 

When it comes to sexual preference if you like guys with light skin, thin lips, average dicks, and proper english then why not look for those specific qualities? If one uses race to look for that person then one might be racist in the bad sense or simply ignorant about how dark, or hung white guys can be or as to how light skinned a black man might be etc.

 

Having and being able to enjoy sexual partners, friends, and neighbors of virtually every culture, ethnicity or race is the greatest gift I could ever imagine.

[Steven_Draker]

Wouldn't this discussion be more appropriate for the Politics Forum?

[jjkrkwood]

Perhaps I was mistaken, but my understanding of BVB's story was that the escort asked him a bunch of questions about himself in an effort to ascertain BVB's race, or more specifically to make sure that BVB was not black. The point of such questioning was not to ferret out an acceptable sex partner, but so that the escort could be sure he did not provide his purportedly professional services to a black customer. Within this context, this is about as clear a case of racial discrimination as you'll ever see. Although you see this as just a sexual encounter, for escorts, this is their job -- they see themselves as professionals. Discriminating against customers on the basis of their race is not professional.

 

If a plumber or carpenter doesnt feel they can do "justice" to your job and meet your requirements, then they will turn it down. a lawyer wont take your case if he is somehow not "in sync" with it. In a profession based on sexual performance, I see NO problem with the escort "ferreting out" information to determine if he's the right guy for the job, and if he is NOT attracted to black men, and the client iS, then clearly he is not the right man for the job.... Still no problem here.... Now perhaps his motivation WAS racism.... All I'm saying is that we dont know from the interchange and the escort shouldnt be condemmed in these pages for it unless it was a known Fact.... EVERY "professional" still has a right to turn down a job ! For me, professionalism is doing the best job for your client and BEING the best person for the job. Being courteous and efficient and communicative ONCE you have been hired. Has nothing to do with TAKING the job on...

[citylaw1]

Agreed, variety is the spice of life, BUT not everyone posseses a taste, or Need for "sexual" variety, and they should not be condemned and labelled for their limitations.

 

Agreed. Who cares if the escort is racist, ageist, hates fat people or whatever! We aren't talking about the local school board, coop, or boss at your place of work. We are talking about putting a penis in an ass for cash. At least, in this instance, you are finding out beforehand.

[citylaw1]

If a plumber or carpenter doesnt feel they can do "justice" to your job and meet your requirements, then they will turn it down. a lawyer wont take your case if he is somehow not "in sync" with it. In a profession based on sexual performance, I see NO problem with the escort "ferreting out" information to determine if he's the right guy for the job, and if he is NOT attracted to black men, and the client iS, then clearly he is not the right man for the job.... Still no problem here.... Now perhaps his motivation WAS racism.... All I'm saying is that we dont know from the interchange and the escort shouldnt be condemmed in these pages for it unless it was a known Fact.... EVERY "professional" still has a right to turn down a job ! For me, professionalism is doing the best job for your client and BEING the best person for the job. Being courteous and efficient and communicative ONCE you have been hired. Has nothing to do with TAKING the job on...

 

Comparing escorting to school teacher, plumber, lawyer, etc. where it concerns "profession" is ridiculous.

[jjkrkwood]

Comparing escorting to school teacher, plumber, lawyer, etc. where it concerns "profession" is ridiculous.

 

The comparision was being discussed in the context of being a "Job". I was not referring to education, training and skill sets. The point WAS, just because someone works at a particular JOB doesnt mean they HAVE TO take on particular clients.... Got it now, citylaw ???

[tyro]

The bigger issue, and IMHO, the point of the whole thread, is whether or not they SHOULD.

Tyro

[jjkrkwood]

The bigger issue, and IMHO, the point of the whole thread, is whether or not they SHOULD.

Tyro

 

Why SHOULD'NT they ??? Dont we live in a country of Freedom of choice. ? Again, context here ! I am NOT suggesting a doctor has the Freedom to turn away patients. BUT we are speaking about INDEPENDENT sex workers here. If they choose not to sell their body to a particular client, for whatever reason it may be, there is nothing wrong with that . And just to be CLEAR, I am in no way condoning racism, but even IF the escort IS racist, he still has a choice in what he chooses to do with HIS body. We can discuss should he / should he not till eternity. Its still HIS body and HIS choice.

[unsub2O17]

I've never been asked by an escort what my race is or isn't (nor have I ever asked a potential escort whose picture is not clear). What I can't help wondering is what prompted the escort's question and particular phrasing in the first place? Since BVB is away and, I'm sure, enjoying himself immensely, I think that I'll have to wait for a speculative answer.

[citylaw1]

The comparision was being discussed in the context of being a "Job". I was not referring to education, training and skill sets. The point WAS, just because someone works at a particular JOB doesnt mean they HAVE TO take on particular clients.... Got it now, citylaw ???

 

Actually you referred to it as a "profession" here:

 

In a profession based on sexual performance, I see NO problem with the escort "ferreting out" information

 

And then you equated, in your mind, the "professions" of plumbers, carpenters, lawyers, escorts/prostitutes here:

 

If a plumber or carpenter doesnt feel they can do "justice" to your job and meet your requirements, then they will turn it down. a lawyer wont take your case if he is somehow not "in sync" with it.

 

In hindsight I probably should have pointed out the idiocy of comparing these "professions", in that they are incomparable on every level. How do you equate these very different jobs at all? Carpenters, plumbers and lawyers require licensing. The ramifications for a lawyer turning down a client based on weight or race would be devastating. Where in your small head do you rationalize this? Got it now JJ?

[citylaw1]

Why SHOULD'NT they ??? Dont we live in a country of Freedom of choice. ? Again, context here ! I am NOT suggesting a doctor has the Freedom to turn away patients. BUT we are speaking about INDEPENDENT sex workers here. If they choose not to sell their body to a particular client, for whatever reason it may be, there is nothing wrong with that . And just to be CLEAR, I am in no way condoning racism, but even IF the escort IS racist, he still has a choice in what he chooses to do with HIS body. We can discuss should he / should he not till eternity. Its still HIS body and HIS choice.

 

I agree 100% in the situation of sex workers. Be careful when you compare sex workers to lawyers and state licensed contractors then. Not wanting to be fucked by a black man is not the same as refusing to represent him in court, fix his sewer or build his house.

[josephga]

Oh I don't doubt it comes up. I use to have a black client that got 2 massages a week and he told me he even had it asked of him when booking massages. I've actually had 2 other massage therapist tell me they wouldn't take black clients. I actually had a asian guy ask me just over a month ago if I took Asian guys as clients. I told him I put myself in the same category as dr's & other medical professionals. But I don't expect escorts to follow that same code. what they do is a very intimate act and can't be compared to other industry's

[citylaw1]

I've never been asked by an escort what my race is or isn't (nor have I ever asked a potential escort whose picture is not clear). What I can't help wondering is what prompted the escort's question and particular phrasing in the first place? Since BVB is away and, I'm sure, enjoying himself immensely, I think that I'll have to wait for a speculative answer.

 

I would bet that to the majority of escorts it's not an issue. It's probably the same for weight. If an escort has an issue with race or weight, I would much rather that they get that out of the way prior to meeting with them. I'm sure any black fat guy would want the same courtesy. Full disclaimer, I am white and not fat.

[citylaw1]

Oh I don't doubt it comes up. I use to have a black client that got 2 massages a week and he told me he even had it asked of him when booking massages. I've actually had 2 other massage therapist tell me they wouldn't take black clients. I actually had a asian guy ask me just over a month ago if I took Asian guys as clients. I told him I put myself in the same category as dr's & other medical professionals. But I don't expect escorts to follow that same code. what they do is a very intimate act and can't be compared to other industry's

 

Two escorts that I have used mentioned that they don't accommodate black clients.

[citylaw1]

Some escorts do have a problem with weight, age, race, etc. Some will tell you and some won't. If I were you I would describe yourself to the escort with age, race, weight, height and explain to them that on occasion some issues have been a problem with other escorts and you just to make sure everything will go well.

 

At the end of 17 plus pages, you explained the exact way to handle any hiring situation.

 

This is how I start every initial communication:

 

42, White, HWP, professional, top. Looking for an overnight on Jan 1 in NYC. Are you interested?

[jjkrkwood]

I would bet that to the majority of escorts it's not an issue. It's probably the same for weight. If an escort has an issue with race or weight, I would much rather that they get that out of the way prior to meeting with them. I'm sure any black fat guy would want the same courtesy. Full disclaimer, I am white and not fat.

 

YEAH but you still have "discriminating" taste.....

[jjkrkwood]

At the end of 17 plus pages, you explained the exact way to handle any hiring situation.

 

This is how I start every initial communication:

 

42, White, HWP, professional, top. Looking for an overnight on Jan 1 in NYC. Are you interested?

 

And you then became enraged when a recent escort turned you down, and you made up some shit about his professionalism and response time and you trashed the guy.... Now THATS the way to handle things professor......You can obviously dish it out, but you aint too good at taking it back !

[citylaw1]

And you then became enraged when a recent escort turned you down, and you made up some shit about his professionalism and response time and you trashed the guy.... Now THATS the way to handle things professor......You can obviously dish it out, but you aint too good at taking it back !

 

1. I was never enraged.

 

2. Had I been turned down based on anything that I said above, I would have been perfectly fine.

 

3. I made up absolutely nothing.

 

4. I reviewed his claimed professionalism and response time, alluding to his reliability where extended or advance appointments were concerned.

[citylaw1]

YEAH but you still have "discriminating" taste.....

 

Don't we all?

[jjkrkwood]

1. I was never enraged.

 

2. Had I been turned down based on anything that I said above, I would have been perfectly fine.

 

3. I made up absolutely nothing.

 

4. I reviewed his claimed professionalism and response time, alluding to his reliability where extended or advance appointments were concerned.

 

Maybe, but it seems to anyone who actually paid attention, that the escorts ONLY problem seemed to be with you. His published reviews were all positive. The only negatives were hearsay from YOU based on your interaction, and some story from an acquaintence of yours. Your opus about that particular escort proved nothing to anyone, and only probably served to enhance his business. He owes you a THANKS

[citylaw1]

Maybe, but it seems to anyone who actually paid attention, that the escorts ONLY problem seemed to be with you. His published reviews were all positive. The only negatives were hearsay from YOU based on your interaction, and some story from an acquaintence of yours. Your opus about that particular escort proved nothing to anyone, and only probably served to enhance his business. He owes you a THANKS

 

Actually I received 3 pm's that related the same experience. All referred to flakiness where overnights and travel were concerned. None referenced local hiring. Exactly what I reported in that thread. By the way, I thought that I educated you on the meaning of hearsay in that thread? I'm disappointed that you are still unable to comprehend it. Try re-reading the definition: unverified, unofficial information gained or acquired from another and not part of one's direct knowledge The direct knowledge was relayed to you through my testimony; overruled as usual. You may also want to take a look at the definition of "Opus" a literary work or composition, as a book.

[jjkrkwood]

Actually I received 3 pm's that related the same experience. All referred to flakiness where overnights and travel were concerned. None referenced local hiring. Exactly what I reported in that thread.

 

PM's are "hearsay" honey. If those people really supported you, they should have posted publicly. Based on what was actually made public, your credibility came into question. Sorry !

[citylaw1]

PM's are "hearsay" honey. If those people really supported you, they should have posted publicly. Based on what was actually made public, your credibility came into question. Sorry !

 

Again, you must re-read the "hearsay" definition. How do you define hearsay? I realize that you're trying to use lofty words, however, you must use them correctly. As far as support, I didn't need it. I related facts, and everyone is free to decide based on those facts. I don't require the support of others to verify my thoughts and opinions JJ. I never have.