Avoiding set-ups/stings

[josephga]

when i was fined in 2009 the cop told me he worked at publex in the meat department.

Entrapment is the act of a law enforcement or government agent inducing a person to commit an offense which the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.

they had me on tape agreeing to the fee. what surprised me was the cop getting naked in front of me and going through with the massage. there were big mistakes i made, 1 using my real name on my business. 2 using my business phone as my personally phone. when i called the police over the problem neighbor they ran my name and number and up came my massage ads on every site i advertised on. i was there 6 1/2 years. no one can tell me that me calling the police on that neighbor wasn't what set it in motion. like i said having a massage license was the only thing that kept me out of jail. if id been doing outcalls nothing would have happen due to me having a license. but running a massage studio from an apartment is a no no. they dont issue permits for it i know alot of guys that were arrested doing out call massage to hotels and not having a license

[Mocha]

Dear Mocha,

 

They do not bring cops from out of State but usually cops DO USE out of state numbers for stings... there are more stings with out of state numbers than local numbers... just so you know...

 

However, can you prove any examples? I know this isn't all about prove and tell...but it seems like you're using any example as a way that one can be tricked. I have personally dealt with detectives in 2 different states for unrelated matters and more often than not...they call from a private number.

 

I googled this guy, searched him out on other escort sites, tried to fo find reviews on him on pretty much every escort review site. Couldn't find anything on him at all except for that one ad on that one website. Asked about him here and others said they'd seen his ad but never worked with him. How and where else would you suggest I dig? If I asked the escort outright whether or not he's a cop, should I just take his word for it if he says that he isn't?

 

You still didn't ask him. You asked everyone else, the world...but no direct talk with him. When I 1st started out (like all of us) I had no reviews, and nobody here probabaly ever worked with me.

 

You don't ask him outright if he's a cop. You state your feelings of nervousness about it and see what his response is.

 

Can you post exactly what he said that made you feel he was a cop? As far as we know, we haven't even seen what questions he made to make you feel that way.

 

In addition, lets knock on wood...but I have yet to see a regular poster come on this site and post about being stung off of rentboy. I understand people's concerns, but alot of this is unfounded and based on speculation rather than facts. Isolated incidences.

[instudiocity]

Entrapment is the act of a law enforcement or government agent inducing a person to commit an offense which the person would otherwise have been unlikely to commit.

And the next two sentences from the same article say:

In many jurisdictions,

entrapment is a possible defense

against criminal liability. However, there is

no entrapment where a person is ready and willing to break the law and the government agents merely provide what appears to be a favorable opportunity

for the person to commit the crime.

 

Here's the link to the full Wiki article from which josephga captured the first sentence: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrapment

 

By your statement, you were advertising your willingness to break the law by offering massages in your apartment. Were you entrapped or were you willfully breaking the law?

[josephga]

i never claimed entrapment. nor did i take that line from wiki i found it else where. I had a massage license which is ran by the state of GA. I assumed they would have said something they also knew i did it from home I thought once the state took over how massage was controlled that the local authority's were no longer involved. I used my real first and last name on my business had cards in gyms and doctor offices i didn't intentionally break the law nor do i think it was entrapment .I don't think my charges had anything too do with me giving massages from home. it was all over me and a neighbor who had only lived there a few weeks getting into it. this neighbor was employed by the apartment complex. after reporting her to her boss nothing changed and i called the police week later im charged. they didn't give a shit i gave massages it was just an excuse to do nothing about that neighbor. forget she and her bf called me a faggot in the parking lot threatened me for reporting them for animal abuse and disturbing the peace dealing drugs in the parking lot.

[instudiocity]

i never claimed entrapment. nor did i take that line from wiki i found it else where.

Well, you have to admit, it was a direct quote of the Wiki sentence.

 

One canon of law is that ignorance of the law is no defense. If you'd read the laws regarding massage therapist in Georgia, you would have known you cannot do it in a private residence - probably more specifically, a residence in specific residential zones. In California, where I have a business license, I had to go through secondary screening assuring the licensing agency that I would not be conducting a business that requires visits from customers, vendors, or delivery people beyond the normal - postman, UPS driver or FedEx driver. Their biggest worry was whether my business would increase traffic in my neighborhood.

 

Also, I'm guessing, in your lease, you've got verbiage that specifically precludes you from conducting any business in your apartment that involves increased traffic. It only makes sense that the city zoning laws and the apartment management wouldn't want to damage the quality of life in the community. Random comings and goings of unknown persons creates a whole mess of problems, as you testified to with the drug-dealing.

 

I agree 'the fix was in' when you went against an apartment co. employee, but the police just as likely learned about your business from the employee than a computer search. You may have given them your driver's license as an ID and they cross-referenced your massage license from there. And, finally, do you see the irony in the results of your complaint? Your complaining about their business bit your business in the butt?

[josephga]

yup you are right it says in a lease you can't run a business from home. my mother use to do hair she ran the business from home but had to go though all kinds of zoning laws to do it. which you cant do in a apartment or condo. i was there 6 1/2 years even though it said in the lease no businesses they knew i did it. they told me once they didnt mind because i always paid on time and had no complaints.. until i called the police on their employee. i know it was my fault. 1 mainly a risk i took doing in calls. 2 getting involved and calling the police. i know reporting her for animal abuse was a good thing however when you are breaking the law yourself you have too like iv said b4 walk with your head held low.. this woman was pure hell blasting rap music all into my apartment, raising hell in the parking lot. on top of animal abuse. i should have packed my stuff up and got the hell out lol

[instudiocity]

i should have packed my stuff up and got the hell out lol

And now you've got two separate phone numbers, live in a different jurisdiction, don't use your name in the massage advertising, keep a low profile and life is good?

[josephga]

And now you've got two separate phone numbers, live in a different jurisdiction, don't use your name in the massage advertising, keep a low profile and life is good?

 

NO the whole thing left me so rattled i never gave a massage again. I never could get the fear of it happening again someday out of my head. I now wait tables in a resturant and work part time at starbucks and donate some free time to a few charitys.

[Guest FTLdude]

You still didn't ask him. You asked everyone else, the world...but no direct talk with him.

 

How do you know this?

 

You don't ask him outright if he's a cop. You state your feelings of nervousness about it and see what his response is.

 

My question about me asking him outright if he's a cop was intended to be rhetorical. I wouldn't expect him to tell me he's a cop if his intention is to bust me.

 

Can you post exactly what he said that made you feel he was a cop? As far as we know, we haven't even seen what questions he made to make you feel that way.

 

We didn't talk about any of this stuff...just availability and rates. If you go back to be earlier posts, you might note that the reason the question (and this thread) came up is because I asked the board for feedback on a previously unreviewed escort and people who looked at the ad said they think that the rate is suspicious.

 

 

In addition, lets knock on wood...but I have yet to see a regular poster come on this site and post about being stung off of rentboy.

 

That's probably true. But just because it hasn't happened yet doesn't mean that it won't.

 

I understand people's concerns, but alot of this is unfounded and based on speculation rather than facts. Isolated incidences.

 

Does the idea of cops using telephones and the internet to set up stings to bust escorts, clients, and others really seem unfounded and speculative to you? As far as we know, they may not have yet done this with the Rentboy website but they certainly have done it before with other sites like Craiglist. I wouldn't call these incidents 'isolated' either. I don't know it for a fact, but I'd guess that more than just a few people have been busted in this game before.

 

I'm not paranoid about hiring, but I don't see anything so bad about being careful and asking advice from people who have been doing it a long time and know more about it than I do.

[Pegasus]

Just curious... Are certain U.S. cities known for male escort stings more than others? If so, which ones? I mostly hire local Texas boys and have never heard of any of them having problems. On the other hand, I have been told by visiting (out-of-state) escorts about vice stings they've heard about in Miami, Vegas and Nashville.

[jasoncarter_dfw]

Just curious... Are certain U.S. cities known for male escort stings more than others? If so, which ones? I mostly hire local Texas boys and have never heard of any of them having problems. On the other hand, I have been told by visiting (out-of-state) escorts about vice stings they've heard about in Miami, Vegas and Nashville.

 

Nashville does regular stings on backpage.com (not sure about rentboy). I know of someone busted there by their "specialized investigations division"...at their hotel room incall. $1000 cash and cell phone confiscated, held on really high bail...took $3k spent on a lawyer to get the whole thing handled. Needless to say after helping out with that situation I have dropped Nashville from my travel city list!

[Guest Ryaan_Morgan]

Nashville does regular stings on backpage.com (not sure about rentboy). I know of someone busted there by their "specialized investigations division"...at their hotel room incall. $1000 cash and cell phone confiscated, held on really high bail...took $3k spent on a lawyer to get the whole thing handled. Needless to say after helping out with that situation I have dropped Nashville from my travel city list!

 

Dane Michaels and I are finishing up a tour of the midwest and east coast! We scheduled Nashville as one of our tour cities but received several heads-up information from three different sources that warned us of the major police stings that happen on a regular basis in Nashville, so we diverted the city all together.

 

...We have permanently removed Nashville from our tour list.

[Guest Magnus]

Just my two cents, but most people are under the misguided assumption that if you ask "are you a cop?", that an undercover cop must say that he is in fact a police officer. WRONG: go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200. An undercover cop can lie and say that he is not a cop, that IS NOT considered entrapment.

[josephga]

Just my two cents, but most people are under the misguided assumption that if you ask "are you a cop?", that an undercover cop must say that he is in fact a police officer. WRONG: go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200. An undercover cop can lie and say that he is not a cop, that IS NOT considered entrapment.

 

your 100% correct. also putting disclaimers on websites about not contacting you if you are a member of law enforcement or government agency are worthless.

[Guest SAEP10]

Gonna resurect this thread, cus I think I mighta made a huge mistake >_<

 

So, I'm 23, virgin, and planned to do something about it whilst I wait overnight at an airport hotel. I sent a few emails out, got a reply from two, and one of them I liked the look of, so I sent him an email. Basically, I couldn't have been more descriptive if I tried. I stated exactly what I wanted.

 

Looking through the advice here, I'm kinda worried now. This guy is on a couple of sites, including men4rentnow where I contacted him, and also his own page. He has 3 reviews that I've found scouting around: 2 reviews on Crusing for Escorts (which links off of m4rn), though they're both from 08; and one on daddy from May this year, which is ringing alarm bells, as is the fact that his rates are relatively low, and he accepted my offer of 2hrs @ $250 without any bargaining needed. But worst of all, he asked for headshots, and I sent him two pics of me.

 

On a scale of one to ten, how fucked am I? (no pun intended). We've arranged to Sun, I have to phone and confirm day before. As much as I was really looking forward to this, and getting rid of the big V, I'm now thinking i'm best off cancelling the whole thing. Cus, more than the obvious problems with being arrested, I'm on a study visa, and need to be able to come back into the country, adn i'd imagine having this kind of criminal charge on my record would be the end of my college career. I'm thinking maybe I should email back, saying that I've had a change of heart. That way, in the unlikely event that this is some kind of setup and the cops show up with the pic I sent, technically I haven't done anything wrong *yet*, right?

 

Any and all advice appreciated. Thanks.

[josephga]

Gonna resurect this thread, cus I think I mighta made a huge mistake >_<

 

So, I'm 23, virgin, and planned to do something about it whilst I wait overnight at an airport hotel. I sent a few emails out, got a reply from two, and one of them I liked the look of, so I sent him an email. Basically, I couldn't have been more descriptive if I tried. I stated exactly what I wanted.

 

Looking through the advice here, I'm kinda worried now. This guy is on a couple of sites, including men4rentnow where I contacted him, and also his own page. He has 3 reviews that I've found scouting around: 2 reviews on Crusing for Escorts (which links off of m4rn), though they're both from 08; and one on daddy from May this year, which is ringing alarm bells, as is the fact that his rates are relatively low, and he accepted my offer of 2hrs @ $250 without any bargaining needed. But worst of all, he asked for headshots, and I sent him two pics of me.

 

On a scale of one to ten, how fucked am I? (no pun intended). We've arranged to Sun, I have to phone and confirm day before. As much as I was really looking forward to this, and getting rid of the big V, I'm now thinking i'm best off cancelling the whole thing. Cus, more than the obvious problems with being arrested, I'm on a study visa, and need to be able to come back into the country, adn i'd imagine having this kind of criminal charge on my record would be the end of my college career. I'm thinking maybe I should email back, saying that I've had a change of heart. That way, in the unlikely event that this is some kind of setup and the cops show up with the pic I sent, technically I haven't done anything wrong *yet*, right?

 

Any and all advice appreciated. Thanks.

 

I doubt that its a cop. male cops normally pose as clients not as male escorts. however I personally think you should cancel just because the guy asked for pics. I contacted a guy for a massage once and he asked for pics, I said no thanks.

[Guest FTLdude]

Any and all advice appreciated. Thanks.

 

I am also new to this and at first I was apprehensive, too. But I recently did my first hire and it turned out very well.

 

Regarding your questions, what is the average market rate being charged in your area by similar type guys?

 

Based on what others have posted previously in this thread I would agree with Joe that this guy doesn't sound like a cop. But I also think that you should cancel anyway. He asked for a pic, which is an indicator that he's particular about the way you look. Who knows what other hang-ups he may have? There is a recent thread about this, in which many people posted that they would definitely NOT send a pic to an escort because they feel that a general description of themselves over the phone should suffice. This is business, and you are the client with the money to spend. You have the right to ask for discretion, and they have the right to refuse you as a client. But, its still business. All you have to do is go back on Rentboy and look for somebody else. Choose somebody who's open-minded enough to come over and provide you with a good experience regardless of how you look and who doesn't NEED a pic in order to do that. Just be honest about how you describe yourself, that way he won't be surprised or disappointed when you open the door.

 

Regarding the rate, I also thought that the first dude I wanted to hire was charging too low. But your potential hire is charging much lower. I'm thinking that he probably doesn't intend to spend the entire 2 hours with you but plans to collect the whole $250 anyway aslong as you go past 60 minutes. Maybe this is the reason he didn't haggle over price. For your first time, and especially because of the personal circumstances you mentioned, I think you would do best to follow the same advice that others gave to me for my first hire: choose an escort who is well-reviewed on THIS site, not that other one you mentioned. If you can't find a fairly recent review then post a '411' info request with a link to the escort's profile on The Deli board so that people here can tell what they know or think about the escort.

[Guest SAEP10]

Thanks both of you for your replies!

 

I'm thinking that he probably doesn't intend to spend the entire 2 hours with you but plans to collect the whole $250 anyway aslong as you go past 60 minutes. Maybe this is the reason he didn't haggle over price.

 

So my question is this:

 

Well, context first. The (shameful!) thing is that for me, this is the first time for EVERYTHING. I haven't even kissed a guy, and if I'm honest, I'm probably looking forward to this kind of intimacy more than all out fucking (though that is definately a close second!). So I kinda plotted out in my head that I'd want a sort of BF experience, to be slowly introduced to kissing and just having that sort of contact. Then my ticklist is oral both ways, fuck him, and depending how I'm feeling on the night, be fucked. And I just didn't see getting that all in in an hour, but given standard rates, there's no way I can get much more money together before Christmas. And I really want to do this now, I kinda need to for my sake.

 

So my question (cus I was trying to get somewhere!!) is, and I'm sorry for the dumb-virgin-y-ness of the question, but am I gonna get all these things done, in an hour, without feeling like we're either rushing to the point of it being less pleasurable, or just generally feeling like we're clockwatching the whole time. Is all that in 60 mins really feasable?

 

If not, I'm thinking that I could maybe stretch to $300 for say 90 mins, but how do I communicate this with a potential escort? I've found another on Daddy's that has more than enough reviews, good ones, and his rate is averaging about $200-220 so I think he could maybe be convinced to take 300 for 90 mins, but how do I ask without tripping over this illegality thing?

[jawjateck]

As a client, I have never done a "quickie" (e.g. 1 hour), but I would suggest that in such a short appointment, and considering your newness to this, focus on one or two things that you really want to experience, savor, enjoy, etc such that you will want to try again with another stud du jour. Otherwise, it will be an unsatisfying blur trying to force too much into a short session. Real pros can make it happen, but they are rare performers.

 

As for the potential escort, simply describe yourself, the bf-type experience you want, and ask him "what is your rate for 90 min?" If it fits your budget, awesome! Have fun! If not, move on, but don't haggle. That usually does not end well.

[Guest Magnus]

As they say: You never forget your first time! First, let me start off by suggesting that you pose this question as a new thread on "Ask an Escort". This current thread is more about the "legalities" of escorting. Your question is really about having the best first time experience with a guy possible. Call it something like "My First Time, Ever" or something like that. The only reason I suggest posting a new thread is that you will find many escort are very empathetic to first timers, and this thread is not about that topic. For example, the escort I hired for my first time was really turned on by the fact that I was still a virgin. In fact I think our session went for an extra hour and he didn't charge me for it. The other thing I might suggest is that you post a question on the "Deli" board for escort recommendations in your city. Good luck, and welcome to the club!