Overnighter goes flat - it's a long one

[Guest rizzuto]

Do write a review. It will make you feel better about the experience, and better toward yourself.

 

You hired this man to play a role, to be your date for the evening and overnight. You have every right to expect him to fulfill that role. It's not the same as dating someone and hoping that they'll like you, nothing close to that. He accepted the job, and there's no way that his job performance can be considered acceptable.

 

If it were me, I would not be especially concerned about having made a mistake, but I would consider it to be a learning experience. I'd think that, if the same thing were to happen to me again, I'd confront the escort early on, politely but clearly, and tell him my expectations are. If he continued not to live up to those expectations during the evening, I'd essentially fire him, paying him proportionately for the time spent.

[axebahia]

>I lead him into the bedroom and while

>on the bed he was a cold fish. Kept dozing off, turning his

>back to me. I was trying to get something from him when about

>1 AM I just sat up and said this isn't working. He asked if I

>wanted him to leave and I said yes. I asked what I owed him

>and he said his full fee which I gave him.

 

After my suicidal escort experience, I decided to get back on the bike right away for an overnight. When the escort arrived - incidentally one I had booked further in advance than my normal habit, but one who only intrigued me in one pic out of about 10 - he was not at like his pics. In particular, he had bad teeth. His mouth was closed in his pics. After some chit chat, I told him it was not working and offered him half his fee plus transport. There is no point forcing it if the chemistry ain't there, but I am afraid you only learn that with experience.

 

You must treat every escort encounter as a trip to the casino. Decide in advance how much you are prepared to lose before going home. When you hit your limit, just go home. It's not your fault that the chemistry was not there, but it is not necesarilly his either. In the end, he should have asked for half and hiked away. My guy (forgive me Ben Nicholas) and I ended up chit chatting about experiences where he had been the one to call it off.

 

I recall having a great weekend in my homewith an escort I had never met before, but the next time he met me in a hotel it just did not work. I called the agency and sent him home early, paying half his fee. Shit happens. Get back on that bike real soon. That therapy will help you more than writing a review which despite what Hoo said here, if he likes your escort or has some prior involvement with him, may never be published anyway.

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

Gives a new meaning to 'Shit Happens' eh?

 

 

 

 

Warmest Always,

 

 

 

Benjamin Nicholas

[axebahia]

>Gives a new meaning to 'Shit Happens' eh?

 

That really pisses me off, I already used that one in my post below!:-)

[buttnovice]

Hello Gentlemen - I am heartened by your responses. Thank you. I have no wounds to mend and guess the reason for the post was to get your opinion of what you would have done at the given moment(s).

 

All in all it was a bad experience and probably best left in the past. However your responses guided me to approach the gent once again. . . this time directing him to this thread. He is aware of your opinions. In a phone conversation since my posting he related to me that he was not in a very good place in his personal life. I left our conversation open ended. He said he was willing to meet again for some sort of make up session. The details were not discussed clearly.

 

Here are my thoughts: I think the gent in question is sincerely a good person - but a little too overwhelmed by his new popularity and appeal. He is going through difficult row in his life: financially and a break up with his boyfriend. I am willing to see him once again in a make up session as outlined previously.

 

Should he not be willing to accept this proposal. . . should I reveal his identity or just walk away from the whole thing?

 

I'm really trying to offer a fair and balanced account of this situation.

 

I thank you for your responses. I'll wait to see what you have to say and then will retire the entire issue.

 

BN

[+ glutes]

>"You certainly didn't owe him his whole fee..." I'm in 100%

>agreement with you on this. After the client had taken the guy

>to dinner and had bought him that expensive drink and the

>escort being quite inactive-- hell no his full fee should not

>have been paid.

>

>Two weeks ago I had a date in San Francisco with an escort who

>did not connect, I told him that I didn't want to continue and

>gave him half his fee once he had dressed; he accepted it,

>apologized, and left.

 

Axiom, please reveal who this escort is!

Could it be someone moving to the stock brokerage business, or Austin???

[OneFinger]

>I think the gent in question is sincerely a good person - but a little too overwhelmed by his new popularity and appeal. He is going through difficult row in his life: financially and a break up with his boyfriend. I am willing to see him once again in a make up session as outlined previously.

 

>Should he not be willing to accept this proposal. . . should I reveal his identity or just walk away from the whole thing?

 

>I'm really trying to offer a fair and balanced account of this situation.

 

I think you need to re-read your first post and really evaluate your latest suggestion. Sounds to me like the guy is playing you for a fool. The overnighter was NOT your first contact with the guy so he knew your personality, likes, and preferences. Without regard to that info, he treated you like a cheap trick and took advantage of you (IMHO).

 

Here are things you previously said which I feel warrants a review.

 

"...At one point he did quote me a $300 higher fee because it was a holiday weekend, but later stood by his original quote."

 

First indicator he was trying to scam you.

 

"...He seemed very, very tired and I offered for him to go take a nap, several times. He declined... I would occasionaly touch his arm or something and it was never returned."

 

Red light #2 that he wasn't interested in your needs.

 

"...We ended up going to a restaurant of his choice even after I outlined my preferences... There he had another drink from the mini-bar ($14 with a mixer...) Nothing happened... he was a cold fish. Kept dozing off, turning his back to me. I was trying to get something from him when about 1 AM I just sat up and said this isn't working. He asked if I wanted him to leave and I said yes. I asked what I owed him and he said his full fee which I gave him."

 

Unprofessional and inexcusable.

 

"...Feeling awkward and like I had hurt HIS feelings I told him to stay. The next morning was a rerun of the night before. NOTHING..."

 

Sounds like he knows which of your buttons to push.

 

"...Later we chatted and e-mailed... He admitted to being off and tired, and offered to make it up to me with an hour off the clock the next time I was to be in his town."

 

IMHO he should have offered to return your fee. After all, I'm assuming you had already paid for his trip to see you. That is enough "reward" for his gross lack of effort.

 

"...I thought about it and suggested in an e-mail that he make-up the overnighter and that I would be willing to pay all his travel expenses to meet wherever and whenever mutually convenient. 2 weeks later I chatted him and he said he was behind in his e-mail. A week later I called him and he was to call me back. That was 2 weeks ago. No response."

 

I honestly can't believe you'd consider paying again for his travel. I don't think this is a "casino" situation where you can roll the dice again and possibly win. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

 

BN, I've always been impressed by your previous posts and feel you'd be a great guy to meet and know. But I feel the actions of this escort warrant an honest review. They DO NOT deserve another paid trip.

[VaHawk]

If you posted a review of this escort less than an year ago, then the rules will not allow you to post a second review (that's just the escort bias of this site and a fact of life). If not, then by all means, as has been stated often, then post a review of this experience as that benefits all the clients who come here.

 

I agree 100% with the comments by OneFinger. You were not treated right and the escort in question was Totally Unprofessional to let his personal life interfere with his professional life. After all everyone else in other professions who do this are often summarily dismissed.

 

What do you owe this guy, by giving him yet another chance to disappoint you? From what I've read, he was great as a first time one hour appointment and a total disappointment on the overnighter, so I really don't understand why you would expect it to be different this time. If you can't post a review due to the rules, then I would suggest you name the escort here, as that is all you can do, and if you are unwilling to do that, then the whole point of your post is moot. I hope you don't take this as a personal criticism, but as Ann Landers always said, the only one who can make you a doormat is you yourself.

 

The best in whatever you decide.

[kjun]

Do you have some comprehension that this board is not an Ann Landers column? If you wish to participate, you also have an obligation to assist others in finding good escorts or pointing out bad ones. Almost every addition to your initial entry encouraged you to write a review. You, however, sidestepped the entire issue. Don't just whine. Do something which will help all of us.

.

the Cajun

[Guest Tristan]

You seem to have a double standard, Mr. Vahawk. I completely agree that bn was treated terribly and should write a review. I can't believe he put up with all that c**p. However, when I recently wrote a negative review with some very legitimate complaints, you referred to it as a "pissing contest" between the escort and myself. Just because you don't know me was not an excuse to write off some extremely serious comments. Here's what you wrote at the time:

 

"... I am continually amazed at the defense/rationalization by some clients for the bad treatment they have received by escorts. To come to this site and rationalize such treatments either here in the mc or in reviews/not posting reviews is a real disservice to both clients and good escorts."

 

I don't know how well you know "bn", but you should give any reviewer serious consideration whether you know the person or not; otherwise you are discouraging lesser known members from writing reviews, thereby subjecting other members to the same unprofessional escort behavior that you supposedly are vehemently against. You treat clients writing negative reviews with a double-sided forked tongue.

 

While I frequently agree with the opinions you express on this site, your comment referring to my review showed complete lack of understanding of the issues (assuming you even read them carefully), incredible insensitivity, and total disregard for the inappropriate actions of the escort. If you didn't understand the issues, then you had no right to refer to my experience in such a derogatory manner. You wouldn't like it if you wrote a review, and someone treated that review the way you treated mine.

 

Although I had a lot of positive support, I was also subjected to your flippant nasty reference, which was totally out of line. So why should anyone trust you when you encourage him to write a review?

 

Tristan

[VaHawk]

Well, I can't honestly state, that I am aware of the post you are referring to, but I will honestly state that I will freely express my opinion on any issue under discussion. I will also assert my right to change my opinion about any issue, as that is my prerogative.

 

I don't discourage anyone from writing a review, whether a first timer or a long time poster. As a matter of fact, I believe I have often questioned the outright dismissal of reviews by first time reviewers by the some of the long timers on this site.

 

Why you would let anyone's posts on this board dissuade you from making further reviews, is your own personal issue to deal with in your own personal way. Don't lay the blame on others for your actions or lack thereof.

[Guest Tristan]

>I don't discourage anyone from writing a review, whether a

>first timer or a long time poster. As a matter of fact, I

>believe I have often questioned the outright dismissal of

>reviews by first time reviewers by the some of the long timers

>on this site.

 

You don't encourage members to write reviews by referring to their problem with an escort as a "pissing contest" when you haven't even taken the time to understand the facts, or don't understand what happened. In such cases, best to keep your mouth closed. This is not about your right to freedom of speech. It's about courtesy and common sense. You ignored all of the following:

 

1) The escort involved is a chronic liar (supported by another member's comments.) He lies about his age because his agent and a book on escorting says it's ok. His pics are not current.

 

2) He shows up with a medical condition instead of cancelling.

 

3) In his Response to my post, he disclosed my message board SN and my real first name in violation of the rules of this site on protecting personal identity. This in itself should have told you sonmething about the veracity and reliability of anything a person like this says.

 

4) His entire response was riddled with absurd distortions. Another member saw through this when the escort when so overboard in his reply, he undermined his own credibility.

 

Apparently, you didn't care about any of the above. Fine. Then just stay out of it. But to refer to the dispute as a "pissing contest" is ignorant. You should have addressed the above issues if you wanted to stick your nose in the dispute.

 

>Why you would let anyone's posts on this board dissuade you

>from making further reviews, is your own personal issue to

>deal with in your own personal way. Don't lay the blame on

>others for your actions or lack thereof.

 

I never said I would be dissuaded by you from writing another review, not did I say I was blaming you for my actions. You are distorting the issues. You flippantly disregarded my complaints without any understanding of what they were. (BTW: You have plenty of "pissing contests" of your own.) Second, your kind of comments do discourage other members from writing reviews. Who wants to be subjected to abuse from other members who utter insensitive flip comments in passing and don't address legitimate issues.

[VaHawk]

"Yes, I went ahead with the appointment. Vahawk, you're absolutely right. I should have sent him packing without compensation. I am a very logical and rationale person. However, when sex is involved, we don't always act logically. What can I say? I'm only human, and humans make mistakes. (He is very cute and has a nice body.) Temptation won over rational thinking. First of all, I was afraid the escort could get violent if I sent him packing without compensation. He had gone the extra mile to get transportation to do an outcall for me. I am a non-violent person and have a slight build.

 

Second, I was completely caught off guard and was unable to quickly react to the situation. I had been looking forward to seeing him for a week and was really psyched for the session. I hadn't used an escort for years due to bad past experiences, and I thought I had carefully chosen a good one. I made the mistake of believing him that he was totally non-contagious. Third, I didn't know the protocol for a situation like this. For example, do you pay him nothing, half, etc.? So I spent the whole session uncomfortable. Matters were complicated by the fact that other things had gone wrong. The escort had been less than truthful about other non-health related matters. This made things worse. By the time I was able to rationally and emotionally react to the situation, the session was over and he was gone.

 

Again, you're right. He should have cancelled the session, giving some nonspecific explanation about a medical problem.

 

If anything like this ever happens again, I would definitely send the escort packing"

 

I really don't know what you are referring to as this is in response to the only post I made about this. Seems like I'm not the only one speaking with a forked tongue.

 

And I will "stick my nose" into any damned open discussion I feel like. I don't need either your permission to post on any topic nor your approval on what I post.

 

Of course, you could always start your own local chapter of BooHooVille.

[Guest Tristan]

Vahawk, you have managed to distort and confuse so many things, it's impossible to have a rationale dialogue with you.

 

YOU HAVE THE WRONG THREAD!!! There were two threads. The quotes you used were from a thread I started about the escort showing up with the remnants of oral herpes. I've been talking about the thread started by Arthur on the escort's response to my review. That's where you made your passing statement about the "pissing contest."

 

I have repeatedly stated that I don't question your right to freedom of speech. You can say anything you damn please. However, that doesn't make it right to say anything you damn please, especially if it out of ignorance of the issues. I stated some of the key issues in my last reply to you. You ignored all of them. My point was that there were some really serious things that the escort did that deserved criticism, not a flippant comment. You refuse to stay on the subject, but instead you just keep asserting your rights under the Constitution. So I'll assume you are temporarily brain dead and end this discusion.

 

Have fun saying random, meaningless, and insensitive things because after all, that is your right.

[KY_TOP]

>. . . this time directing him to this thread.

>He is aware of your opinions. In a phone conversation since my

>posting he related to me that he was not in a very good place

>in his personal life. I left our conversation open ended. He

>said he was willing to meet again for some sort of make up

>session. The details were not discussed clearly.

 

If he is aware of this thread then I would think that the possibility of a poor review will probably cause him to be more responsive to you "IF" you decide to meet again. But, will it be the normal experience one might expect since he may fear the negative repercussions of a review or even that you would reveal his name hear?

 

>Here are my thoughts: I think the gent in question is

>sincerely a good person - but a little too overwhelmed by his

>new popularity and appeal. He is going through difficult row

>in his life: financially and a break up with his boyfriend. I

>am willing to see him once again in a make up session as

>outlined previously.

 

If you see him again I strongly advise you to limit the Alcohol consumption by him. It appears that had something to do with your last experience.

 

>Should he not be willing to accept this proposal. . . should

>I reveal his identity or just walk away from the whole thing?

 

Numerous people have advised you to write a review. If he is as popular as you, say don't you think you owe it to others to warn them of your bad experience? That is sort of what this site is about.

 

>I'm really trying to offer a fair and balanced account of this

>situation.

 

Then I'd suggest that even if you see him again, WRITE A REVIEW and add in your experiences for all 3 times you have seen him. The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly...a balanced picture. If you don't see him again then write about the first 2 meetings, the Good one and the Bad one...again a balanced picture.

 

I can understand how it can be hard to get past a bad experience and in a case were the original meeting was good, to wonder why things crashed the second time. Maybe meeting him again will help resolve it in your mind and then again maybe it won't. It's your roll of the dice.

[VaHawk]

I thank you very much, as I appreciate your acknowledgement of my rights to post, just like I acknowldege your right to drag this point out ad nauseum. I certainly apologize for quoting the wrong thread, but damn man, I had to go back 24 pages and 6 months looking for a thread originated by you, and thought I had found it since you cite the instance about the escort with a disease (cold sores) above.

 

Do me a favor in your future attacks against me and post the link to the thread under discussion, because I will never go thru that much effort again for you or anyone else who posts here. If you felt this way about my post then you should have stated it at the time, so I wonder why you let it stick in your throat for months before stating your feelings.

 

You can attack me all you want and question/ridicule my comments all you want as that is the essence of an open forum. If I stated at the time you were having a "pissing contest" then if I revisited the thread I might feel differently, but I doubt it very much as I always post my true feelings on the topic under discussion at the time, and unlike you, I don't wait for months to respond and leave my response up to an unclear arguement that includes references to more than one thread. Very confusing to say the least.

 

BTW: in case you haven't noticed this in open forum on the internet in which not everyone has to agree with your opinions and you really need to come to grips with the reality that you may get dissed and/or have your statements questioned and/or dismissed. If you can not deal with the realities of the situation, then you know where the exit is and please don't let the door hit you on your way out.

[Guest Tristan]

Vahawk, why don't we just calm down and end this. Again, I don't question your right to freedom of speech. Nor do I expect everyone to agree with me. You seem to have ignored all the issues I stated re my conflict with the escort, so there's no point in my continuing to get thru to you on these issues. What bothers me is that what seems to be most important to you is to say anything you please, regardless of whether it makes any sense. It just happens that, while I believe in freedom of speech, I also believe in people thinking before making inflammatory comments which have no basis in reality.

 

You see, I have this philosophy. I don't believe people should make insensitive, dumb comments without understanding the facts. That may be your legal right, but it is also morally wrong and irresponsible. I don't believe you ever carefully read my review, the response, and the thread authored by Arthur carefully.

 

I was ticked that your wrote such an insulting comment without even reading some very supportive replies to my complaint and trying to understand the facts. Anyone who read everything carefully could easily see a chronic liar. There may be two sides to every story, but more often than not, one person is lying. So I think a person should either read things carefully and thoughtfully, or just stay out of it. How would you like it if you had a serious complaint and someone wrote it off as just a "pissing contest"? That's a very derogatory comment with all sorts of implications. I don't think YOU would appreciate it.

 

I had good resaons for not responding to your comment earlier. Usually I do respond right there and then.

 

There are too many personal feuds already on this site. We don't need any more. As I have stated before, I frequently agree with your replies which I have read in various threads. So for my part, I will not let this unpleasant dialogue prevent me from agreeing or supporting you (or disagreeing) on other future issues, and I would hope that you would so the same. Peace!

 

End of story, I hope.

[VaHawk]

I sincerely apologize if I offended you in anyway, but I don't consider any opinions right or wrong, and can not condone any kind of censorship on free speech.

 

But I definitely have absolutely no ill feelings of any kind against you as an individual.

 

You have been very cordial during this discourse, which I appreciate, and please never hestitate to disagree with me on any issue and state how you feel. I know I can get nasty as hell, but I mostly do that when people are nasty with me first, which you have not been during this discourse.

 

If you ever feel I am out of line, just tell me at the time, without name calling and aspersions, and you will find in return, that I can be the same.

 

Have a great day and thank you for your much appreciated sanity in calling a halt to this disagreement before it reached the realm of insanity. :)

[+ Unicorn]

This experience had nothing to do with having a bad day or being in a bad place. This guy clearly showed his scam artistry from before you even got together. Trying to charge you extra for the "holiday week-end" was an early warning sign and had nothing to do with his having a bad day when you did get together. He clearly didn't care one iota for your feelings. Arriving tired, not letting you pick the restaurant you wanted, and then getting sloshed when he should have been attending to you constituted incredibly rude and dishonest behavior. Sometimes we excuse a man's behavior because the guy has us turned on sexually, but this guy's behavior was almost beyond belief.

A review would serve to hopefully prevent others from suffering the same experience you went through. Writing one would likely save at least a few people some grief. You and your conscience have to decide whether to write one...

[buckguy]

A couple thoughts---even if you try to be "sympathetic" to his situation, recognize that he wasn't very professional. To draw an analogy----A psychologist who is having a hard time with a personal problem should not be seeing patients with anything resembling that problem (and maybe not see patients at all). An escort who's having relationship problems probably should not be doing overnighters or anything else that makes him uncomfortable. A sympathetic view may be that he was trying to get out of it by pricing himself too high, so you'd refuse and he wouldn't have to explain why he wasn't really interested. OK, so that's the sympathetic view and it still advises against being "nice". Also consider, that he may have had some guilt or at least embarrassment afterward, and probably wouldn't want to have an appointment with you again. Indeed, if he figured out who you were (or you told him), he might come up with excuses not to have an appointment with you, even an hourly. Again, that's taking the sympathetic view. If he knew who you were and accepted an appointment from you, without some evidence of contrition (like making it a freebie), it probably would confirm all the unsympathetic judgments about him. Regardless, your review of all your encounters would be valuable and would give us a better idea of this guy's character and the situations where he can perform.

 

Another "sympathetic" view---he isn't an "overnighter". I've done a couple overnights with guys who were great hourly appointments, but not great over the longer haul. One was socially awkward and had less experience than I would have expected with extended appointments. The other proved to be a better companion than sex partner for a long stay. My experiences with overnighters based on their reviews here, rather than via a good hourly hire have been a bit better than these guys. The readers here need to know if someone is better at one kind of appointment rather than another. And that's still a "sympathetic view".

 

Finally, consider that all escorts are not wonderful all the time. I once gave a mediocre review to an escort---the escort didn't squawk but the next reviewer did. I was annoyed at the reviewer's need to make his experience seem wonderful in a way that suggested that something was wrong with me, rather than recognize that "mileage may vary". It just reinforced for me that we need to know the full range of experiences with a guy and not take for granted that someone will be perfect company for everyone everytime. Don't be shy---one negative or even qualified review among many will not be a big deal, indeed, it will be statistically "normal" and if the escort objects, it probably just adds to the wisdom for writing the review, in the first place.

[duke37]

I hope this doesn't sound gushing but the preceding is a fantastic post. Thanks for posting your thoughts. Excellent advice.

 

Jeff

[BobbyB]

>I hope this doesn't sound gushing but the preceding is a

>fantastic post. Thanks for posting your thoughts. Excellent

>advice.

>

>Jeff

 

I wholeheartedly agree, Jeff. His post was outstanding. So is BN's sense of fair play for that maatter. Maybe a little too so, but I'd rather he err on the side of caution than take an inappropriately large pound of flesh.

 

That said, however, I think if he refuses to make good on the make-good offer, then BN should definitely write a review. Make it as fair and as factual as the original post, but no more. Karma do the rest.

 

And then give it one. A rest that is. After all...it's just nookie. :-)

 

- BobbyB