Here we go again

[axebahia]

OK, I have been contacted by a former regular and (ostensibly) former escort. (He does not advertise any more, but I think he may still see selective former clients although I am not sure if they pay.) Earlier this year, I imported him after a similar call initiated by him on the understanding that I would pay for travel costs and expenses while he was with me. In the end, he asked for his fee to my surprise. I paid it though I was not happy. I have since told him that I thought the weekend was too expensive and that I had not expected to pay his fee. This time, he again says that he "misses me" etc. and has offered to come for travel expenses and expenses while he is with me. On the fee, he says that's not important and we can work it out (or words to that effect.) Do I take the plunge again? If I do, am I justified in refusing the fee if he comes and then asks for it at the end?

[Boston Guy]

Proceeding without a strict understanding of whether there will be a fee or not seems foolish, especially given your last experience.

 

Perhaps he expects to spend time with you and then demand a fee again... after all, you fell for that once before, didn't you?

 

This just feels like a kind of scam to me, regardless of what he thinks or says his personal motives are. If he's a friend, then there's no fee. If he's not a friend and will expect you to pay a fee for the time you spend together, he should be willing to make that clear beforehand. Anything else is underhanded.

 

To quote the late Ann Landers, "wake up and smell the coffee!"

 

BG

[+ glutes]

You say it all with your title to this post.

[topcat]

I'm not so sure. You are both adults. If you have a good time with the guy and enjoy his company, why not have him join you?

 

If at the end of the weekend, he asks for something, you can judge whether you want to give extra based on how much he pleased you. Of course, this means that if he has not pleased you, you have to be able to say No....but, as I say, you are an adult; you can do that.

 

I would be interested to know the name of this guy. If he has been reviewed here before, it may be that he does this regularly....and if you publish his name/city, you may find that others have recent experience of him. You may prevent him developing a scam on clients who are less robust and unable to handle the situation so well.

[FrancoDiSantisxxx]

Naming Names

 

I will say it before and I will continue to say again.

 

Communication is a wonderful thing. Being clear and specific ensures that there are no misunderstandings. The vague, oh, well let's play it be ear and see how we fell response only ensures that unless one or both of you are mind readers, some hard feelings will be in store for all.

 

ASK ASK ASK QUESTIONS. Be very precise. Tell him to bring the condoms, tell him to pack a tie, tell him you are a vegan, tell him he NEEDS to get hard even if takes a jar full of viagra, tell him you want sex six of the eight hours you are together, tell him you snore, tell him you do not kiss.

 

But for goodness sake, do not complain if something important was not raised in advance. By all means, be spontaneous, but if you know something matters (i.e., you have a limited amount to spend), be very specific.

[axebahia]

>I would be interested to know the name of this guy. If he has

>been reviewed here before, it may be that he does this

>regularly....and if you publish his name/city, you may find

>that others have recent experience of him. You may prevent him

>developing a scam on clients who are less robust and unable to

>handle the situation so well.

 

He has not been reviewed here much to my surprise. He was on Rentboy in NYC for about 6 months last year with amazing pics and charging only $200/hour.

 

He was definitly one of my best regulars ever, but from the very beginning pricing was murky. I think he could have easily charged more, but I think he preferred to keep the price down and try to have more extended encounters. I know another two escorts who did threesomes with him and they agreed he was amazing.

 

At any rate, I think he came to on-line "escorting" after having had preferred relations with a small set of clients beforehand. I think that is his preference, but I told him from the start I was not into that. At the beginning, he suggested that in lieu of payment, I take him shopping or purchase other non-sexual services from his other profession. I declined, but we continued to meet severl times a week, sometimes for more than an hour at a time.

 

So the confusing part is that when he quit escorting, we continued to see each other, and as I indicated above he has initiated these more recent encounters in ways that show no commercial aspects up-front.

 

I am inclined to go through with it, but decline to pay the fee if requested in the end because I think I have been sufficiently clear on the subject. Do you think I should be more explicit? I think he will equivocate again. Isn't it enough that I am clear that I see it as a non-commercial encounter for which I am agreeing to pay only travel and expenses while he is with me? In that case, it seems to me the risk is on him, but then aain I would hate for this to have a messy ending, and he is a nice guy.

[TightBodyTouch]

Oh my god! Here we go again, is right.

 

Don't hire him. Don't accept his advances. Don't tell us about it. If you do, you'll undoubtedly find a world of opportunity for discrediting this escort and how the arrangement left you feeling used, misunderstood, and angry. If this escort doesn't even advertise and only contracts his appointments by reaching out to past clients then that's your first red flag. Beyond that, you have only demonstrated a particular flair for confusing your escorts and yourself by making communication scarce among you.

 

On the other hand, since he gets in touch with you repeatedly he may very well be privy to your habits and tastes. That, or you're leaving out the fact that you have a 12 inch penis which asserts itself for 18 hours a day. Since the latter is highly unlikely, I suppose your gamble has a 50/50 chance of working out. Obvious to most of us, any escort leaving himself open to "work it out when I get there" is the one who needs lady luck by his side.

 

If he does, in fact, head out to visit you what do you intend to do with him? You don't like to do tourist events, you're afraid that someone will snap a pic in the streets, and you don't intend to pay his fee... y'all gonna stay in and braid each other's hair and paint each other's toe-nail?

 

That reminds me, I need a pedicure.

[giovoni]

He's fibbing.. he just had a pedicure...

 

 

Gio in Denver

http://www.angelfire.com/co3/massagebygio

[axebahia]

RE: Naming Names

 

>But for goodness sake, do not complain if something important

>was not raised in advance. By all means, be spontaneous, but

>if you know something matters (i.e., you have a limited amount

>to spend), be very specific.

 

The problem with that is that it makes sense in a commercial context, but what if we have moved from there to a non-commercial context? I think I have said enough to indicate that I don't view this as a commercial enounter. Short of cross-examining him and making him sign on the dotted line, I don't see an easy way to do more. That's the problem. We are in a grey zone, I know. The question is whether we are there legitimaely or whether this is some advanced business strategy.

[axebahia]

>If he does, in fact, head out to visit you what do you intend

>to do with him? You don't like to do tourist events, you're

>afraid that someone will snap a pic in the streets, and you

>don't intend to pay his fee... y'all gonna stay in and braid

>each other's hair and paint each other's toe-nail?

 

Actually, my comment on the other thread was specific to Paris and to the escort concerned in that case. Having lived in Paris, frankly it does not hold for me the charm that it does for the uninitiated. I think a lot of people feel that way about cities where they live when friends and relatives come to visit. (Also when there is a significant age difference, frankly there is very little in common between escort and client other than sex so that s why in those cases I prefer just to give the escort downtime on his own.)

 

With the escort who is the subject of this thread, I am sure we could find enough to hold our attention in the hotel and outside of the hotel. BTW, don't be too sure about that 18inch dick remark! As for pictures, he has never asked to take one with me so I don't think that problem will arise. So the only problem then is some freelance photographer he wants to invade my privacy, but I think the only "ferry" rides if I go through with it this time will be in the hotel. :-)

[TightBodyTouch]

Good Luck then, since you've been together before and have lots to occupy you both then I'm sure it will work out. But I swear if you come here later and say that he was out of line to ask for his fee after your enormous penis kept him awake for the weekend then I will have to say I warned you.

 

And if you do have an 18 inch penis, I'll come to see you for free too.

[axebahia]

>But I

>swear if you come here later and say that he was out of line

>to ask for his fee after your enormous penis kept him awake

>for the weekend then I will have to say I warned you.

 

Why so? On my part, I have been clear that I don't see it as a commercial encounter. He called me and told me what he wanted me to do to/with him? If he wants a fee for that, isn't the burden on him to say so and what it would be? So my inclination is that this time if asked for a fee at the end I will decline, and I will come back here and bitch and scream afterwards too!

[TightBodyTouch]

hehehe I'll bet big money you're gonna scream and bitch about something or other, sooner or later. I look forward to it! ;-)

[topcat]

The thinking of this guy/escort is very interesting....I know of a similar case in London. A handsome guy with a great body, very well-reviewed on this site, who says he has stopped escorting.....

 

Yet he continues to see "friends" who happen to be guys he met while escorting. As part of going round to see a "friend", he gets naked, has his body admired, gets rimmed, sucks them/gets sucked and sometimes bottoms. He prides himself on never asking for money, but somehow each time, he gets given money or expensive gifts afterwards. He always follows up with emails and phone calls to say "thank you" for the meeting/evening

 

His psychology fascinates me because he never refers to clients, only to his "friends" with whom he keeps in very regular contact!

[axebahia]

>His psychology fascinates me because he never refers to

>clients, only to his "friends" with whom he keeps in very

>regular contact!

 

Funny, a few months ago, I called him and one of his friends answered his cell phone while he was in the bath room and asked if I was "one of his john friends or a real friend"? I said "ask him?" When I later told him about this, he changed the subject quickly and said that his friend was just messing around.

[axebahia]

>Funny, a few months ago, I called him and one of his friends

>answered his cell phone while he was in the bath room and

>asked if I was "one of his john friends or a real friend"? I

>said "ask him?"

 

Actually, his friend asked if I was "one of his trick friends, or a real friend"? He later got up set with me when I asked if his family knew of his "other career". He then said, it was never a career, just a fantasy that he wanted to check out, and he made some great "friends" while doing it.

[Guest DevonSFescort]

I don't know about you, but I don't go around asking my friends and people I have non-commercial relationships with for bus fare, let alone to fly me anywhere. It sounds like what he's seeking is indeed a commercial relationship, albeit a modified one, and if you're amenable to that, fine. But I'd tell him straight up that there's nothing to "work out" vis-a-vis the fee, since you won't be paying one. If he wants to fly out and spend time with you on your dime anyway, and you're happy with that arrangement, then there's no problem.

[axebahia]

>I don't know about you, but I don't go around asking my

>friends and people I have non-commercial relationships with

>for bus fare, let alone to fly me anywhere.

 

Thanks, as usual that's very insightful. I have thought about that. I do subsidize flight by family to visit me, and have done so also in "relationships". I imagine that is very common. I admit I would not fly him over if sex was not part of it, but that is probably true in other contexts as well. I would not pay the way for a friend, but I would pay the way for a "friend plus".

[Guest Merlin]

What seems obvious is what you haven't said; that in person you have a hard time saying no. He is so sure of his ability to manipulate you that he is willing to travel to you with no prior agreement. And you are unsure of your ability to resist. They are not called hustlers for nothing. He obviously does see this as a commercial transaction and probably would not come to you if he did not think he would get paid. If you set a fee in advance, you may not be able to resist his attempts to increase it. You apparantly want him to come but don't want to pay him, even though you know that is how he makes his living. Examine your own motives. Are you perhaps just trying to get something you want without paying for it, even though that is how he makes his living? If you don't like him well enough to pay him, you should tell him not to come. Just my opinion and of course, I don't know all the history etc.

[axebahia]

>You apparantly want him to come but don't want

>to pay him, even though you know that is how he makes his

>living. Examine your own motives. Are you perhaps just trying

>to get something you want without paying for it, even though

>that is how he makes his living? If you don't like him well

>enough to pay him, you should tell him not to come. Just my

>opinion and of course, I don't know all the history etc.

 

Those are fair comments. What I have said to him from the very beginning is that I would not import him if I had to pay more than travel and hotel costs because I could do better than that locally. I told him that when we were in the same city and he proposed a "sugar daddy" relationship of sorts. Then, I explained to him that I did not need to retain one escort's services for that kind of time because there were so many others out there in that city, and that when I had rented for extended periods prior to that it was because of lack of availability where I was. So I am not trying to get something for free at all. I like him, and we have a good time, but if he did not call me, I would not think of importing him if I had to pay. Maybe, he does not believe me?

[Boston Guy]

No, he probably does believe you. But he also probably believes that once he is in front of you that you'll buckle under and pay him a fee again. And why shouldn't he believe that? It's what happened last time...

 

I think you're just setting yourself up for a reasonably uncomfortable scene.

 

BG

[axebahia]

>No, he probably does believe you. But he also probably

>believes that once he is in front of you that you'll buckle

>under and pay him a fee again. And why shouldn't he believe

>that? It's what happened last time...

>

>I think you're just setting yourself up for a reasonably

>uncomfortable scene.

 

I think you are right on the money. I am fairly confident I can stare him down this time if he asks for a fee at the end. We had our dust ups over money in the past where I felt he was purposefully prolonging the encounters beyond an hour by fudging the lines. I do like him though, and would hate to have an uncomfortable scene, but I am inclined to think that as long as I have been clear, at the end of the day I should not worry about it. He has a certain plausible deniability, but I think you are right, he knows my position.

[Traveller]

Now I wouldn't be the first one t say anything, but since I haven't been to bed yet, and I had three of my favorite whores doing blow with me all nght, I say the answer to your query is punt.

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>I do subsidize flight by family to visit me, and have

>done so also in "relationships". I imagine that is very

>common.

 

Yes -- though usually, I'm guessing, the people you subsidize are visiting you at your invitation, not theirs, and not following on the heels of a business relationship in which there has been a conflict about money. I'm just saying I think it's tacky of him to ask, and that the circumstances make this a unique case, and semi-commercial one.

 

>I admit I would not fly him over if sex was not part

>of it, but that is probably true in other contexts as well. I

>would not pay the way for a friend, but I would pay the way

>for a "friend plus".

 

Question: is your hesitancy to be explicit with him now about the fact that you will NOT be paying a fee based at least partly on a) a fear that he won't want to have sex if he doesn't see a chance of getting more money out of you and b) your desire not to find out the answer at least until it's "too late?"

[Guest JimEricNJ]

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