Chicago Str8 acting College Guy type??

[Guest jeffOH]

>why not try to rid the world of these stereotypes?

 

I'm all for that, maybe we could get Jenny Jones to do Masculine Makeovers for gay men??

 

>some of you said you were embarrassed & disgusted by

>flamboyant displays at Gay Pride parades

 

I find it more annoying than anything. Yes, there are effeminate men, straight and gay, who are that way naturally. But, I think alot of the behavior and mannerisms that many gay men exhibit are affected and reflect their insecurities. They want so much to fit in, that they pick up on the gay lingo, call each other "girl" or "sister", have female nicknames for each other and believe "bitchy queen talk" is real conversation. I just wish they would drop the "gay act" and be themselves and quit perpetuating the stereotypes.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[Guest jeffOH]

>why not try to rid the world of these stereotypes?

 

I'm all for that, maybe we could get Jenny Jones to do Masculine Makeovers for gay men??

 

>some of you said you were embarrassed & disgusted by

>flamboyant displays at Gay Pride parades

 

I find it more annoying than anything. Yes, there are effeminate men, straight and gay, who are that way naturally. But, I think alot of the behavior and mannerisms that many gay men exhibit are affected and reflect their insecurities. They want so much to fit in, that they pick up on the gay lingo, call each other "girl" or "sister", have female nicknames for each other and believe "bitchy queen talk" is real conversation. I just wish they would drop the "gay act" and be themselves and quit perpetuating the stereotypes.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[axebahia]

>Prime example: an innocent post by Bastian announcing himself

>to prospective clients, which is supposed to be one of the

>functions on the board. Based on a photo alone, all the pc

>police had to come out and take over the thread with racist

>accusations and political bs, and now his thread is in the

>politics forum. Now how damn ridiculous is that? :-(

 

There is nothing at all innocent about wrapping yourself in a Dixie flag as a marketing tool. A picture is worth a thousand words especially when the escort defends the picture as an expression of his values and refuses it to take it down. I don't know if Bastian is straight acting or not, but he sure is not racially sensitive or modern. If an escort wore a dress in a picture and then got pissed when folks commented that he was not straight acting, wouldn't that sound a bit strange? We are all in control of the image we want to project to a great degree, and having projected a certain image we lose the right to whine and bitch when others call us by the labels that we wear.

[axebahia]

>Prime example: an innocent post by Bastian announcing himself

>to prospective clients, which is supposed to be one of the

>functions on the board. Based on a photo alone, all the pc

>police had to come out and take over the thread with racist

>accusations and political bs, and now his thread is in the

>politics forum. Now how damn ridiculous is that? :-(

 

There is nothing at all innocent about wrapping yourself in a Dixie flag as a marketing tool. A picture is worth a thousand words especially when the escort defends the picture as an expression of his values and refuses it to take it down. I don't know if Bastian is straight acting or not, but he sure is not racially sensitive or modern. If an escort wore a dress in a picture and then got pissed when folks commented that he was not straight acting, wouldn't that sound a bit strange? We are all in control of the image we want to project to a great degree, and having projected a certain image we lose the right to whine and bitch when others call us by the labels that we wear.

[Guest ncm2169]

AMEN !!!

[Guest ncm2169]

AMEN !!!

[Guest Love Bubble Butt]

Amen!!!

[Guest Love Bubble Butt]

Amen!!!

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>>some of you said you were embarrassed & disgusted by

>>flamboyant displays at Gay Pride parades

>

>I find it more annoying than anything. Yes, there are

>effeminate men, straight and gay, who are that way naturally.

>But, I think alot of the behavior and mannerisms that many gay

>men exhibit are affected and reflect their insecurities. They

>want so much to fit in

 

Leaving aside the question of how you distinguish the "naturally" effeminate men from the ones who are trying to "fit in," when's the last time you heard about a gay man being ostracized for being masculine? For that matter, when's the last time you heard an effeminate gay man complain about the masculinity of other gay men? It seems to me that it would be at least as easy (and credible) to argue that people who are bothered by effeminate behavior are the ones who are being insecure.

 

I'm not denying that some men gradually take on campier mannerisms as they acclimate to being out in whatever gay community they've become a part of. But I don't think it's that different from moving somewhere and losing your old accent and picking up another one. Fair enough, you might like some accents more grating on the ears than other ones, but do you speculate about the psychology of the speaker because you don't like his accent?

[Guest DevonSFescort]

>>some of you said you were embarrassed & disgusted by

>>flamboyant displays at Gay Pride parades

>

>I find it more annoying than anything. Yes, there are

>effeminate men, straight and gay, who are that way naturally.

>But, I think alot of the behavior and mannerisms that many gay

>men exhibit are affected and reflect their insecurities. They

>want so much to fit in

 

Leaving aside the question of how you distinguish the "naturally" effeminate men from the ones who are trying to "fit in," when's the last time you heard about a gay man being ostracized for being masculine? For that matter, when's the last time you heard an effeminate gay man complain about the masculinity of other gay men? It seems to me that it would be at least as easy (and credible) to argue that people who are bothered by effeminate behavior are the ones who are being insecure.

 

I'm not denying that some men gradually take on campier mannerisms as they acclimate to being out in whatever gay community they've become a part of. But I don't think it's that different from moving somewhere and losing your old accent and picking up another one. Fair enough, you might like some accents more grating on the ears than other ones, but do you speculate about the psychology of the speaker because you don't like his accent?

[Rick Munroe]

>They

>want so much to fit in, that they pick up on the gay lingo,

>call each other "girl" or "sister", have female nicknames for

>each other and believe "bitchy queen talk" is real

>conversation. I just wish they would drop the "gay act" and be

>themselves

 

You have a good point, but who is ever really themselves? Straight guys have their own "straight-speak" (calling each other "bro" or "dude" and doing that greeting thing where they touch fists) as does the "hip-hop" generation (of any race) ("aiight, dawg?") and none of it is original by any means. We live in a culture of followers who desperately try to fit in somewhere. I don't think it's a specifically gay phenomenon.

[Rick Munroe]

>They

>want so much to fit in, that they pick up on the gay lingo,

>call each other "girl" or "sister", have female nicknames for

>each other and believe "bitchy queen talk" is real

>conversation. I just wish they would drop the "gay act" and be

>themselves

 

You have a good point, but who is ever really themselves? Straight guys have their own "straight-speak" (calling each other "bro" or "dude" and doing that greeting thing where they touch fists) as does the "hip-hop" generation (of any race) ("aiight, dawg?") and none of it is original by any means. We live in a culture of followers who desperately try to fit in somewhere. I don't think it's a specifically gay phenomenon.

[tedbear]

>I agree with what you're saying, but str8 acting is pretty

>much an ingrained "label" within the gay community <

 

It once was an ingrained term in the community, but that was 20 years ago. Now it's become a phrase that shows our own homophobia.

[tedbear]

>I agree with what you're saying, but str8 acting is pretty

>much an ingrained "label" within the gay community <

 

It once was an ingrained term in the community, but that was 20 years ago. Now it's become a phrase that shows our own homophobia.

[tedbear]

>You find it offensive, fine! Others find it offensive, fine!

>That's your, and their, right. But don't tell me as a gay man

>what 'I' should find or not find offensive.

 

I apologize for my use of the word "should" in this case. I did consider my use of the word carefully before I posted. Even though it is a word I try not to use when advising others (or myself), I felt it was justified in this case only because it is obvioius that some people don't realize the harm they do to others and themselves by using seemingly harmless terms such as this one. If they would stop and consider why some of us find it offensive, they probably will see our point. If not, they're entitled to their opinion, of course, but I will continue to wince (and respond accordingly) whenever I hear or read it.

[tedbear]

>You find it offensive, fine! Others find it offensive, fine!

>That's your, and their, right. But don't tell me as a gay man

>what 'I' should find or not find offensive.

 

I apologize for my use of the word "should" in this case. I did consider my use of the word carefully before I posted. Even though it is a word I try not to use when advising others (or myself), I felt it was justified in this case only because it is obvioius that some people don't realize the harm they do to others and themselves by using seemingly harmless terms such as this one. If they would stop and consider why some of us find it offensive, they probably will see our point. If not, they're entitled to their opinion, of course, but I will continue to wince (and respond accordingly) whenever I hear or read it.

[Rick Munroe]

>Now it's become a phrase that shows our own homophobia.

 

Exactly.

[Rick Munroe]

>Now it's become a phrase that shows our own homophobia.

 

Exactly.

[Flower]

[font color="blue"

]>I'm not denying that some men gradually take on campier

>mannerisms as they acclimate to being out in whatever gay

>community they've become a part of. But I don't think it's

>that different from moving somewhere and losing your old

>accent and picking up another one. Fair enough, you might

>[font color="green"

](find) [font color="blue"

]some accents more grating on the ears than other ones,

>but do you speculate about the psychology of the speaker

>because you don't like his accent?

[font color="green"

]

I think you're correct--there is a change as people acclimate and settle into something comfortable--gay or not. While I was a totally closeted gay, I avoided effeminate guys like the plague--didn't want guilt by association (but not that I am somewhat out, I really don't care and am quite comfortable with most gay guys, effeminate, drag or otherwise, the sole issue being the individual not his mannerisms. I think that when clients ask for "straight acting" it might be that they are closeted and either don't feel comfortable in a gay world yet or else just don't want to be "guilty by association" if they intend to be out and about with the escort. Of course it could just be that masculine turns a guy on more so than prissy, but in that case, like Taylor first said, ask for masculine and not str8 acting.

 

People that dont' love and respect themselves will not likely have others doing it for them:+

[Flower]

[font color="blue"

]>I'm not denying that some men gradually take on campier

>mannerisms as they acclimate to being out in whatever gay

>community they've become a part of. But I don't think it's

>that different from moving somewhere and losing your old

>accent and picking up another one. Fair enough, you might

>[font color="green"

](find) [font color="blue"

]some accents more grating on the ears than other ones,

>but do you speculate about the psychology of the speaker

>because you don't like his accent?

[font color="green"

]

I think you're correct--there is a change as people acclimate and settle into something comfortable--gay or not. While I was a totally closeted gay, I avoided effeminate guys like the plague--didn't want guilt by association (but not that I am somewhat out, I really don't care and am quite comfortable with most gay guys, effeminate, drag or otherwise, the sole issue being the individual not his mannerisms. I think that when clients ask for "straight acting" it might be that they are closeted and either don't feel comfortable in a gay world yet or else just don't want to be "guilty by association" if they intend to be out and about with the escort. Of course it could just be that masculine turns a guy on more so than prissy, but in that case, like Taylor first said, ask for masculine and not str8 acting.

 

People that dont' love and respect themselves will not likely have others doing it for them:+

[Guest jeffOH]

Nobody said that it's exclusively a gay phenomenon.

 

I've seen gay men change when they're in a group of their gay friends.

That's one way to tell nature vs. the environment.

 

And we all don't pick up on those mannerisms. I think that has alot to do with how comfortable you are just being yourself as opposed to blending in with the crowd and becoming "clonish", whether it's straight or gay. I'm always reminding an otherwise masculine friend of mine that I'm not his "sister". I can be his brother, but cut the "girl" crap.

 

They're stereotypes because there are some who continue to perpetuate them. ncm2169 isn't someone who is turned on by "campy queen behavior" natural or affected, neither am I. He expressed this preference with a term that I wouldn't have used, but he still made his point.

 

I find it interesting that there are people who are offended by the term "str8-acting", but seem to have no problem with gay men who

perpetuate the stereotypes by their "affected" behavior.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[Guest jeffOH]

Nobody said that it's exclusively a gay phenomenon.

 

I've seen gay men change when they're in a group of their gay friends.

That's one way to tell nature vs. the environment.

 

And we all don't pick up on those mannerisms. I think that has alot to do with how comfortable you are just being yourself as opposed to blending in with the crowd and becoming "clonish", whether it's straight or gay. I'm always reminding an otherwise masculine friend of mine that I'm not his "sister". I can be his brother, but cut the "girl" crap.

 

They're stereotypes because there are some who continue to perpetuate them. ncm2169 isn't someone who is turned on by "campy queen behavior" natural or affected, neither am I. He expressed this preference with a term that I wouldn't have used, but he still made his point.

 

I find it interesting that there are people who are offended by the term "str8-acting", but seem to have no problem with gay men who

perpetuate the stereotypes by their "affected" behavior.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[Guest jeffOH]

>It seems to me that it would be

>at least as easy (and credible) to argue that people who are

>bothered by effeminate behavior are the ones who are being

>insecure.

 

Here you're equating "effeminate" with "gay-acting". To me there's a difference between the two. Some guys(straight and gay)are naturally less masculine than other men. Not all effeminate gay men adopt the Camp Queer mannerisms/behaviors. There's the difference. I suppose (to me) this is most annoying when exhibited by gay men who when they're standing still and not talking appear to be masculine. But, as soon as they open their mouth or walk, that image is blown to hell.

 

You don't have to be the Jane Goodall of homosexual male behavior to be able to notice the difference between "effeminate" and "gay-acting". Also, merely protesting the use of steretypical terms isn't an effective means of ending their use. It's the behavior of the few that perpetuate the stereotypes. I do my part by not going along with the herd and pointing this out to my friends who lapse into the stereotypical gay behavior/lingo/mannerisms without thinking.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[Guest jeffOH]

>It seems to me that it would be

>at least as easy (and credible) to argue that people who are

>bothered by effeminate behavior are the ones who are being

>insecure.

 

Here you're equating "effeminate" with "gay-acting". To me there's a difference between the two. Some guys(straight and gay)are naturally less masculine than other men. Not all effeminate gay men adopt the Camp Queer mannerisms/behaviors. There's the difference. I suppose (to me) this is most annoying when exhibited by gay men who when they're standing still and not talking appear to be masculine. But, as soon as they open their mouth or walk, that image is blown to hell.

 

You don't have to be the Jane Goodall of homosexual male behavior to be able to notice the difference between "effeminate" and "gay-acting". Also, merely protesting the use of steretypical terms isn't an effective means of ending their use. It's the behavior of the few that perpetuate the stereotypes. I do my part by not going along with the herd and pointing this out to my friends who lapse into the stereotypical gay behavior/lingo/mannerisms without thinking.

 

JEFF jeff4men@hotmail.com

[VaHawk]

>I've seen gay men change when they're in a group of their gay

>friends.

>That's one way to tell nature vs. the environment.

 

Or perhaps in a society that is still in many ways homophobic, it is the only time they feel at ease to express themselves. Of course, they change, they don't have to hide behind the closet doors when they are with their "own" in a gay establishement.

>

>And we all don't pick up on those mannerisms. I think that has

>alot to do with how comfortable you are just being yourself as

>opposed to blending in with the crowd and becoming "clonish",

>whether it's straight or gay. I'm always reminding an

>otherwise masculine friend of mine that I'm not his "sister".

>I can be his brother, but cut the "girl" crap.

 

Well, I myself am not that way, but I certainly don't begrudge others who are that way, which it seems you do. They seem to be comfortable with themselves, it sounds as if you are just uncomfortable with them. If you were a true friend, you would accept others and like them for who they are not withold your friendship until they conform to your ideas of what they should be like

>

>I find it interesting that there are people who are offended

>by the term "str8-acting", but seem to have no problem with

>gay men who

>perpetuate the stereotypes by their "affected" behavior.

 

And I find it interesting, that there are so many gay men who can't accept the diversity within the gay community. These are the people who rage at drags and leather men parading on Gay Pride. IMO these people are intolerant, which should be the antithesis of being gay and that these are the people who have trouble accepting themselves and are the ones uncomfortable with who they are (which is a "homosexual"!). These are the people who insist on defining themselves using the criteria of the "so called heterosexual community". As Taylorky suggests use the word masculine which is an adjective not "str8acting" with is a self-effacing, perjorative, offensive label.